EFTA00722980.pdf
Condensed Transcript
IN THE CIRCUIT COURT OF THE 15TH JUDICIAL CIRCUIT IN
AND FOR PALM BEACH COUNTY. FLORIDA
Plaintiff.
vs. Case No. 502008CA028058
XXXXMB AD
JEFFREY EPSTEIN,
Defendant.
PROCEEDINGS BEFORE THE
HONORABLE JUDGE DONALD W. HAFELE
July 31, 2009
8:30 a.m.
205 N. Dixie Highway
West Palm Beach, FL 33401
Jennifer DiLorenzo, court reporter
Toll Free: 800.211.3376
Facsimile: 954.331.4418
c Suite 1300
515 East Las Olas Boulevard
ESQUIR E ampasy
„MarsaderOstlaC
Fort Lauderdale, FL 33301
EFTA00722980
Proceedings July 31, 2009
1 3
IN IRS 411=1/ COUNT OF THE ISTE JUDICIAL CIRCUIT IN 1 Proceedings in the Matter OM. vs. JEFFREY EPSTEIN
AND FOR PALM Ma COUNW, MAIM
2 Jtiy 31.2009 8:30
3 THE COURT: Good morning, gentlemen.
4 We're here this morning on the Plaintiffs
Plaintiff, motions to add punitive damages. Who will be
vs. Case R. 302004CA02$05$ 6 arguing on behalf of the Plaintiff?
ICOnNS AD
JEMMY 8087[10,
7 MR. EDWARDS: Brad Edwards, Your Honor.
8 THE COURT: Alright, Mr. Edwards.
Defendant.
9 MR. EDWARDS: Do I need to go to the
10 podium or is right here fine?
P*00493)17106 SirOle /NI
11 THE COURT: Whichever you prefer.
NONORASLC JUDGE DONAID N HAMELIN
12 MR. EDWARDS: Your Honor, with our motion
July 31, 2009 13 we filed - and, I believe. Your Honor has it -
son a.m. - 9,01 a.m.
14 the decovery that was submitted to Mr. Epstein.
205 K. D1Ale IllgANAY 15 which consists of Requests for Admissions.
meet Vela Beta., FL 33101
16 Requests for Production, interrogatories. as
17 well as Interrogatory responses under oath by my
18 client.
19 THE COURT: Do you have any cases that
Jennifer DiLorenin, Court reporter 20 speak to the presumption relative to the
21 Defendant exercising his Fifth and Sixth
22 Amendment rights during the deposition testimony
23 and/or during any other discovery?
24 MR. EDWARDS: Sure, Your Honor.
25 THE COURT: I Wow that Mr. Odeon in his
2 4
1 APPEARANCES OF COUNSEL 3. reply memorandum Indicated some conflict In
2 2 terms of the nature of the discussions of the
3 On behaA of the Plantiff:
4 ROTHSTEIN, ROSENFELDT & ADLER 3 appellate courts relative to that Issue.
BY: WILLIAM J. BERGER, ESO., 4 MR, EDWARDS: May I approach?
5 lamer Park Office Tower
Suite 675 5 THE COURT: Thank you.
6 225 NE Mizner Boulevard 6 MR. EDWARDS: I'm going to present the
Boca Raton, FL 33432 7 case of Fraser vs. Security and Investment out
7 561.322-776t
wbergerenralawcom of the Fourth DOA.
9 The pertinent part, It says: "Our
ROTHSTEIN, ROSENFELDT & ADLER
9 BY: BRADLEY J. EDWARDS. ESQ, 10 conclusion Is consistent with the prevailing
401 East Las Olas Boulevard 11 rule that the Fifth Amendment does not forbid
to Suite 1650
Fort Lauderdale, FL 33394 12 adverse Inferences against parties to civil
13. 954.522.3456 13 actions when they refuse to testify in response
bedwardserna
14 to probative evidence offered against them: the
12
13 On behalf of the Defendant: 15 amendment 'does not preclude the inference where
14 BURMAN, CSIMON, LLITTIER & COLEMAN 16 the privilege Is claimed by a party to a civil
BY: ROBERT D. CANTON, JR., ESO..
15 515 North Rapier Drive 17 cause?
Sotto 400 18 It skips down and says: 'Such a rule is
16 West Palm Beach, FL 33401
19 both logical and utilitarian. A party may not
17 20 trample upon the rights of others and then
18
19 21 escape the consequences by invoking a
20 22 constitutional privilege - at least not In a
21 23 clvii setting."
22
23 24 The final paragraph on that page says:
24 25 'Nor are we persuaded that the fact of
25
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1 invocation of the privilege is irrelevant and 1 we're not talking about 400, which, I believe.
2 immaterial: 'In the case' -- Sony, 'Mr. 2 is the number known to law enforcement, we are
3 Justice Brandeis... observed that 'Silence Is 3 talking about thousands of children, and it is
4 often evidence of the most persuasive 4 through a very intricate and complicated system
5 character:" that he devised where he has as many as 20
6 Clearly, this case, out of our district 6 people working underneath him that he is paying
7 court. is an indication that adverse inferences 7 well to schedule these appointments, to locate
a may be drawn. 8 these glds.
9 Right now wo are at a punitive damages He particularly goes atter a very
10 stage. We are not at a stage where we are 10 vulnerable and impressionable age group that —
11 talking about the admissibility of evidence. We 11 THE COURT: To use the quotation, 'the
12 are — 12 evidence will show the Defendant sought out
13 THE COURT: Speaking only of a proffer to 13 underprivileged and economically disadvantaged
14 establish punitive damages as required under 14 minor females: and later go on to say,
15 768.721, correct? 15 'influenced them away from the typical
16 MR. EDWARDS: Exactly, and I was going to, 16 adolescent lifestyle as a result of his
17 for the record, read that part of 768.721: "In 17 allegedly criminal acts.'
18 a civi action, there is a" -- 18 MR. EDWARDS: And that is exactly what
19 THE COURT: I think we can skip that. 19 he's done. The age group begins as young as
20 MR. EDWARDS: Okay. 20 12 years old and as old as 16 years old. There
21 THE COURT: The statute speaks for itself 21 will be evidence that at 16 years old, many of
22 and its a part of the record belay, so why 22 the girls are told, 'You're getting too old for
23 don't you go ahead and proceed? 23
24 MR. EDWARDS: The reasonable showing, by 24 He very dearly targets this specific age
25 way of proffer, that there is an Intentional 25 group and has a method to this; that is, "Get
6 8
1 misconduct or gross negligence on behalf of the 1 the girls inside the house and I wiN do the
2 Defendant. 2 rest, and he creates this God-like aura for
3 Intentional misconduct is defined as 'the 3 these girls and --
4 Defendant had actual knowledge of the wrong 4 THE COURT: Let's talk about - pardon me
5 per conduct and the high probabilty for interrupting you - let's talk about the
6 that injury or damage to the claimant would 6 precise deln=at are g made here. You're
7 result and, despite that knowledge, 7 dealing with NMI and theyre pseudonyms
-
8 intentionally pursued that course of conduct for purposes of this litigation. Why don't we
9 resulting in injury or damage.' 9 speak to those two individuals at this juncture
10 In this case, we have intentional 10 and how the punitive damage proffer is
11. misconduct of the worse kind. This is a case 11 sufficient or insufficient relative to them
12 that has been presented to the public through 12 individually, please?
13 public relations people for the Defendant at 13 I understand the global allegations and I
14 times as 'five or six bad under-aged prostitutes 14 understand the allegedly wide scale situation
15 from a high school that. as one of their stops, 15 that you're suggesting as you've alleged here,
16 wound up at Mr. Epstein'S home,' and that's not 16 but I want to go now to the precise claims trade
17 the case at all. 17 by these two Plaintiffs who are in front of the
18 What the evidence is really going to show 18 Court today, and whether or not that proffer is
19 is that Mr. Epstein - at least dating back as 19 sufficient to satisfy the case law, inducing
20 far as our investigation and resources have 20 the case that Mr. Clifton cited, and that is:
21 permitted, back to 1997 or '98 - has every 21 The Estate of Despain, D-E-S-P-A-I-N. vs. Avante
22 single day of his life, made an attempt to 22 Group, Inc., which is found at 900 So.2d. 637,
23 sexually abuse children. 23 and that was a Fifth District Court of Appeal
24 We're not talking about five, we're not 24 case, decided in 2005.
25 talking about 20, we're not talking about 100, 25 MR. EDWARDS: Yes, Your Honor, and that
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the case that states: 'a 'proffer according to 1 the Defendant. I also observed sexual acts and
2 traditional notions of the term, connotes merely 2 had sexual acts perpetrated on me and was forced
3 an 'offer of evidence and neither the term 3 to perform on me. including oral sex and other
4 standing alone nor the statute itself calls for 4 activities. At various times I was unclothed,
5 an adjudication of the underlying veracity...is 5 as was Defendant and others. At all times
6 merely a representation of what evidence the 6 material, I was a child under the age of
7 defendant proposes to present? 7 18 years. I was a victim of various criminal
a We can turn to the sworn Interrogatory 8 acts and sexual exploitation. I was Induced and
9 answers, No. 8, wherein and, similarly, 9 coerced by the Defendant into acts of
10 words, states: 'I 10 prostitution?
Ng, in slightly different
11 was touched, battered, and fondled by Defendant 11 THE COURT: Thank you. You were going to
12 Jeffrey Epstein during the Incidents described 12 speak to a legal point --
13 in the complaint. I observed the Defendant 13 MR. EDWARDS: Right.
14 touch and fondle himself. I observed the 14 THE COURT: — before I asked you to read
15 Defendant ejaculate numerous times. I was made 15 into the record those Interrogatory answers. Go
16 to touch the Defendant. I also observed sexual 16 ahead.
17 acts and had sexual acts perpetrated on me by 17 MR. EDWARDS: Where we left off was the
18 Defendant Jeffrey Epstein. At various times I 18 coercion into prostitution. What makes these
19 was unclothed, as was the Defendant and others. 19 crimes so egregious is the fact that these girls
20 At all times material, I was a child under the 20 that we're talking about were all beginning
21 age of 18 years old. The Defendant also used me 21 their grooming process with Mr. Epstein when
22 to bring him other minor girls and he controlled 22 theyre 14 and 15 and 16 years old.
23 and brainwashed me" -- 23 There is a specific statute, which we have
24 THE COURT: Just a second. 24 filed, and a cause of action under our
25 (Telephone interruption.) 25 complaint, that is under 796.09, Cowden. civil
10 12
1 MR. EDWARDS: "and brainwashed me Into 1 cause of action.
2 believing this lifestyle was healthy and normal 2 Reading 796.09, Paragraph 1: 'A person
3 for a girl my age. I was a victim of various 3 has a cause of action for compensatory and
4 criminal acts and sexual exploitation. I was ♦ punitive damages' - this is in the statute -
5 induced and coerced by Defendant into acts of • 'against a person who coerced them into
6 prostitution' 6 prostitution," and it goes on to define what
7 While we're on the coercion and 7 coercion means, and it is exactly what happened
prostitution, there is a specific — • in this case.
9 THE COURT: Before you move on, thars 9 This statute allows for punitive damages
10 LM.'s -- 10 on a statutory level irrespective of the age of
11 MR. EDWARDS: Yes, Your Honor. 11 the person that is coerced into prostitution.
12 THE COURT: — Answer to IntesTitones? 12 THE COURT: And the coercion that you're
13 Why don't you read into the record 's Answer 13 talking about are the alleged acts as between
14 to Interrogatories so the record is dear? 14 these two Plaintiffs and Mr. Epstein as opposed
15 MR. EDWARDS: I apologize, Your Honor. 15 to, I think, there's something In one of the
16 THE COURT: Take your time. 16 Interrogatories that suggests that there may
17 MR. EDWARDS: Answer to Interrogatory No. 17 have been prostitution that followed, at least
la 8 for.. Indicates: 'My injuries arc 18 one of the Plaintiffs, involvement with Mr.
19 emotional and psychological and are the direct 19 Epstein, but you're speaking solely about the
20 result of Defendant Jeffrey Epstein's actions. 20 prostitution Issues as It concerns the
21 I was touched, battered, and fondled by the 21 Plaintiffs here and Epstein; is that accurate?
22 Defendant during the incidents described in the 22 MR. EDWARDS: I believe, If I understand
23 complaints. I observed the Defendant touch and 23 what you are saying, I mean, In terms of
24 fondle himself. I observed the Defendant 24 damages, if one of the Plaintiffs - and I can
25 ejaculate numerous times. I was made to touch 25 represent - if one of the Plaintiffs was led
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1 into a life of prostitution after being 1 intentional misconduct and/or gross negligence.
2 indoctrinated into this deviant lifestyle at an 2 I think the record is very dear at this
3 early age by Mr. Epstein - she was not a 3 point, especially after this proffer, that if
4 prostitute prior to that • and I relate that 4 any case is deservant of punitive damages being
5 similar to kids of that age being brought over added, its this one.
6 to somebody's house that is as powerful and 6 THE COURT: AlrigM. Thank you. I'll
7 wealthy as him and he has, let's say, cocaine on 7 give you a couple minutes to wrap up after Mr.
8 the table, and they do that for three years. 8 Critton finishes his argument
They think it's fun at the time. but after that MR. EDWARDS: Thank you, Your Honor.
10 they have this addiction that continues on. 10 THE COURT: Thank you.
11 This Is something similar to what happened to 11 MR. CRITTON: May It please the Court. As
12 one of the clients. 12 the Court knows, I represent Mr. Epstein in this
13 But, yes, the coercion into prostitution 13 matter.
14 is something that on a statutory level already 14 Your Honor, a couple of things to start -
15 allows for punitive damages, and that's 15 the case that Mr. Edwards cites deals with
16 irrespective of the age. 16 inferences, deals with inferences at trial time
17 THE COURT: Again, I'm trying to 17 as distinct from inferences that, I believe, are
18 understand the factual basis. There's 18 sufficient to catty the day, so-to-speak, in the
19 allegations that Mr. Epstein paid these young 19 absence of other evidence with Mr. Epstein's
20 ladies $200 to massage him and then subsequent 20 claim of Fifth Amendment privilege, As well, we
21 thereto, there was some type of alleged sexual 21, cited to the court cases - and I'll get to in
22 activity. Are you speaking to that specifically 22 just a minute - that specifically address that
23 when you're talking about the statutory remedy 23 issue.
24 or are you speaking about something distinct 24 Secondly, we're not here on - and I think
25 from that? 25 the Court, I think, I kind of at least got the
14 16
1 MR. EDWARDS: No, theta specifically what 1 drift is we're not here on other claims - we're
2 I am talking about — 2 here on ■. and ■.'s claim today to add
3 THE COURT: Okay. 3 punitive damages and, In fact, 'Do they meet the
4 MR. EDWARDS: -- Mr. Epstein paying them 4 standard under the applicable statute in this
5 arid using their age, their economic - their lack 5 instance?
6 of wealth - the fact that these are poor, 6 What I think Is the most striking part
7 disadvantaged children with very NW parental 7 about this - and while I believe that the
guidance to his advantage to induce them Into 8 evidence may be - their perception, the
9 acts of prostitution. 9 Plaintiffs' perception of the evidence - may be
10 THE COURT: II give you two minutes to 10 afferent than ourselves, but I think the
11 wrap up, please. 11 evidence in this case will show, at least ■.
12 MR. EDWARDS: Okay. 12 and ■., were prostitutes before they ever met
13 Your Honor while I know that we are 13 Mr. Epstein, they remain prostitutes, and they
14 focusing on and there are certain 3.4 are still prostitutes today.
15 defenses that have been made such as. 'The girls 15 THE COURT: But is my role today one of
16 were' - "we didn't know that they were over 18, 16 weighing the evidence or one of determining
17 otherwise we wouldn't have done this,' where we 17 whether or not there's a sufficient record In
18 are going to be able to show there are hundreds 18 order to allow a punitive damage claim to stand?
19 and hundreds and hundreds of girls and none of 19 I mean, in one of the cases, I believe -
20 them were over the age of 18. 20 it's the case of State of Wisconsin Investment
21 Many of these girls, including my clients. 21 Board vs. Plantation Square Associates, that's
22 told him that they were under the age of 18 and 22 found at 761 F.Supp 1569 - Judge Hugler
23 he continued to do this misconduct, which Is 23 (phonetic) of the federal court provided an
24 exactly what the statute or what the punitive 24 excellent discussion of the distinction between
25 damages statute speaks to when it talks about 25 the proofs necessary to sustain a claim for
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punitive damages oven at summary judgment, much 1 FBI agent and a U.S. attorney that was there at
2 less a trial, and compared that with the 2 the time - and she talked about going over to
3 relatively lighter burden of simply making a 3 Mr. Epstein's house. She said, "I had a fake
4 proffer of record evidence to support a claim ID." She was told to make certain that she was
for punitive damages. 5 18. She told Mr. Epstein she was 18, and she
6 MR CANTON: Right 6 said it was her understanding that all of the
7 THE COURT: Aren't we at that stage: that 7 other girls that she brought for this horrific
a Is, the latter stage right now? 8 experience - she continued to bring other girls
9 MR. CFUTTON: Yes, and I very well 9 and go herself on a number of occasions.
10 understand the distinction and. I believe. I 10 She said that she, herself -- On Page 8,
11 understand what the Court's rote is in this 11 it asks, "Did she ever call you?" - and I assume
12 particular Instance In making that 12 that was someone else - and she goes. 'No. I
13 determination. 13 gave Jeffrey my number and, I said, you know, if
14 A coupe of the issues though, In 14 you want me to give you a massage again,
:5 particular • with a camera hero today. for some 15 basically I'm more than anxious to come:
16 unknown reason, showing up at this hearing - is 16 On Page 9, gi says, "I willingly took' -
17 there were references to drugs, alcohol, other 17 'so I willingly, the first time, took off my top
18 instances that are not applicable to this case. 18 when I gave him the massage and nothing more
:9 There's no pleadings on that particular issue, 19 than that:
20 and I'm concerned about that, is that there's an 20 She goes on to say in her testimony at
21 attempt to jack this up in the media, as I said, 21 Page 10, her sworn statement, "I said, I told
22 with the camera here today, for no other 22 Jeffrey, 'I heard that you like massages
23 hearing. Ks ridiculous under the 23 topless.'"
24 circumstances, and to make all of these wild 24 "And he said like, yeah.' He said, 'But
25 allegations against Mr. Epstein for which there 25 you don't have to do anything that you don't
18 20
1 is absolutely no evidentiary proof nor was that 1 feel comfortable with.'
2 submitted here in support of their proffer, I 2 "And I said. 'Okay,' but I willingly took
3 did want to address at that. 3 it off' - this is. at the time. This is her
4 So let me get to the heart of the issue. 4 sworn testimony.
5 I think the most distinguishing part of this 5 At Page 17, the police officer or the FBI
6 it
particular case that's different; that is, 6 agent says, "and when he turned over then did he
7 and is the tact that II. gave a sworn 7 touch you at all or was he just' Her answer
8 statement to the FBI in this instance. was, "No. I did not touch him. he did not touch
9 Again, there's a strong distinction. She 9 me. He didn't even want.." and I assume to
10 gave a sworn statement back in '05 or In '06. 10 'touch you'
11 She had - did - she had an attorney, Mr. 11 She goes on to say, 'He didn't want me to
12 Eisenberg, it was before she had a civil lawyer 12 touch him and he didn't touch me.'
13 who's seeking millions of dollars under these 13 She goes on and on in this statement,
14 circumstances, and the testimony of.. at that 14 .., In the statement and she says, 'We had
15 time was very significant and It flies direcily 15
16 In the face of her 'sworn testimony' or her 16 'It was positive,' on Page 18.
17 "sworn interrogatories.' 17 On Page 19, 'You know, I would wear
18 The Court had Mr. Edwards read inn's 18 panties. Willingly one time, because wo were
19 answer and M.'s answer to their 19 making jokes and everything, and willingly one
20 Interrogatories as to what a6egedly occurred 20 time, I had, yes, I was totally nude, but I was
23. with Mr. Epstein and, 'Oh, surprise,' they were 21 fine with that.'
22 almost verbatim, word for word, as to what 22 She talks about within the statement the
23 allegedly happened. 23 other girls that she brought over. Again, she's
24 But at the time of her sworn statement to 24 testified or she gives the Interrogatory answer
25 the FBI.. said on 4/24/07 - again, it was an 25 that this was outrageous to her, but, yet she
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21. 23
brought other girls to experience this. She 1 and.. in their Answers to
2 says - now that she has a civil lawyer seeking 2 Interrogatories have made all sorts of, what we
3 money damages - now 'it's a bad experience." 3 believe In part, are baseless or In large part
4 Now all of a sudden. "He touched me, he did 4 baseless alleations, but we also have sworn
these things to me.' 5 testimony off.. on this instance.
6 She references - at least, on Page 29 of 6 We don't have it of.., but we have..
7 the statement, Judge - there's a 'W" that's 7 testifying about her own experience under oath:
a referenced. "W' I would represent to bell. In That it was positive; that he never used force,
9 the . complaint, and I think we established 9 that she willingly did a number of times
10 that when Mr. Berger and I were a aT! ng a prior 10 including giving topless massages; that Mr.
11 molten to you. So she talks about.. on Page 11 Epstein never touched her; that she never
12 29. 12 touched him inappropriately, all she did was
33 That's when she starts saying, she says, 13 basically give him massages; that.., in this
14 TUT - "she; meaning.., 'was my baby's 14 instance, as well as all the other girls that
15 father's girlfriend al the time' 15 she took, she spoke with them afterwards, they
16 Then on Page 30, "How old wasS? 16 begged to go back to Mr. Epstein's home, and
17 the was 17." 17 none of them, not one of them ever complained.
18 Alright, so you have 12, 13, 14, 15, 16. 18 So there's a large chasm between what is
19 You haves. saying 'W" was 17 at the time. 19 now being asserted In Answers to Interrogatories
20 "And what happened when W came over?' 20 and mere allegations In the complaint between
21 She said the same thing. "She went a few 21 what the sworn testimony, at least., was
22 times.' 22 under the circumstances, as it relates to
23 On Page 31,n testified under oath to 23 herself and what she was told by.. and other
24 the FBI and the United Slates attorii:None of 24 girls.
25 my girls ever had a problem. And NM call 25 Thank you, Your Honor.
22 24
1 me. They begged me, you know, for us to go to 1 THE COURT: Thank you.
2 Jeffrey's house because they loved Jeffrey. 2 Mr. Edwards, Ill give you a couple
3 Jeffrey is a respectful man, he really Is. I 3 minutes here.
4 mean, he all thought we were of age, always, 4 MR. EDWARDS: Your Honor, I want to
that's what's so sad about it.' 5 address the statement that was made by.. to
6 And she goes on, Page 36, and the FBI says 6 the FBI and how that even came about. This is a
to her, 'Now, when you were working for him, you 7 girl who, at the time of the statement, was
8 were going over to Jeffrey's house to give him 8 faith/ unaware of the investigation against Mr.
9 massages, did you have a boyfriend? 9 Epstein, who is now, as we know, a convicted sex
10 10 offender.
11 'And how did your boyfriend feel about 11 An attorney showed up to her house, paid
12 it?" 12 for by Mr. Epstein, to represent her despite -
13 'He was" --S. says, 'He was a Jealous 13 and told her that, "For your role, you could
14 little boy, but he didn't care, 'Bring home the 14 possibly be implicated In some wrongdoing.'
15 bacon,'" and the statement goes on and on, Your 15 MR. CRITTON: Your Honor, just —
16 Honor. I know you've had an opportunity read It 16 MR. EDWARDS: He represent —
17 before and I reference again today. 17 MR. CRITTON: -- note my (Medial. This
18 There's clearly a distinction conflict 18 Is complete hearsay here. He was aware of what
19 between., now that she has a civil lawyer 19 was filed. He didn't file any affidavits for
20 and she wants money, versus at the time that she 20 his client in opposition. I would object to any
21 didn't want money and she gave a statement under 21 of this.
22 oath to the FBI and the United States attorney's 22 THE COURT: Alright. I don't want to get
23 office. 23 Into any of the details. I don't third( it's
24 I recognize the Court's rote in this. I 24 necessary at this juncture, which probably leads
25 recognize the standard. I recognize that both 25 me to my question to you; that Is: Is the
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weighing of evidence appropriate at this 1 The Court finds that, while I appreciate
2 juncture? 2 Mr. Critton's argument and while I appreciate
3 MR. EDWARDS: No, Your Honor, I don't 3 his submission, that essentially at this stage.
4 believe that's the standard at this stage 4 respectfully, he is, at this point, presenting
anyway, and I don't think that Mr. Craton 5 countervailing evidentiary submissions.
6 believes that either. 6 The Court further goes on in paraphrasing
7 Just so the record's clear, we had nothing 7 and then directly quoting Judge Hugler
8 to do with the video camera being here, although 'Therefore a proffer is merely a representation
that was implied. I don't know who did. 9 of what evidence the defendant proposes to
10 don't know it it was Mr. Critton, but it wasn't 10 present and is not actual evidence' Actually,
IL me. 11 that's a quote from prim vs. State. 841 So.2d.
12 THE COURT: Dan is always welcome here. 12 455, 462, and that, I believe, is a Florida
13 MR. EDWARDS: It's perfectly fine, but I 13 Supreme Court case, even though the citation
14 don't Ike that being on the record, that it 14 itself is not complete.
15 looks Ike I did it when I didn't. 15 It goes on to say importantly - and that
16 THE COURT: I understand. We have a 16 is in the Despain case -'A reasonable showing
17 record here. The official record Is being taken 17 by evidence in the record would typically
18 down by our fine court reporter. so. 18 include depositions, interrogatories, and
19 MR. EDWARDS: Either way, sounds like what 19 requests for admissions that have been filed
20 we just heard, that the reason that punitive 20 with the court. Hence, an evidentiary hearing
21 should not be allowed here is because these 21 where witnesses testify and evidence is offered
22 14-year-old girls did this willingly. 22 and scrutinized under the pertinent evidentiary
23 We know that they're 14 years old, Mr. 23 rules, as in a trial, is neither contemplated
24 Cotton knows they were 14, 15 year olds. There 24 nor mandated by the statute in order to
25 were message pads and scheduling books in 25 determine whether a reasonable basis has been
26 28
1 Epstein's possession indicating the dates, which 1 established to plead punitive damages,' and I'll
2 would show how old those girls were, and that's 2 admit this citation from the Fifth District
3 evidence that will be presented in this case. 3 Court of Appeal, but, again, that is cited in
4 There aro serious statutes to protect 4 Despain.
5 these kids from this kind of conduct, and these 5 Likewise, in Strasser vs. Yalarnanchl, 677
6 second and third degree felonies were committed 6 Sold. 22, which is a Florida Fourth District
7 repeatedly against them, and this is a case 7 Court of Appeal case from 1996, which is one of
13 where, at least in a civil case, punitive 8 the parar$gm cases on the proffering of punitive
9 damages are warranted, Your Honor. 9 damage evidence, that states that 'there was
10 Thank you, Your Honor. 10 reasonable basis for recovery of punitive
11 THE COURT: Thank you both. I'm going to 11 damages' can be demonstrated by either a
12 grant the motion. In conformance with and 12 presentation of supporting evidence already in
13 following the Despain case, the Court indicates, 13 the record or by a proffer of the evidence to
14 in following the analysis of Judge Hugler - and, 14 COMO.
15 by the way, that analysis of Judge Hugler is 15 I find that a combination of the Answers
16 commented upon on a supportive basis by several 16 to Interrogatories - I will take into account.
17 appellate courts - and in the Despain case under 17 though, give little weight to the Fifth
18 headnote 7 and 8 on Page 642 it states: 'a 18 Amendment arguments of Plaintiffs - but
19 'proffer according to traditional notions of 19 certainly the Answers to Interrogatories on
20 the term, connotes merely an 'offers of evidence 20 behalf of both of these Individual Plaintiffs in
21 and neither the term standing alone nor the 21 this Court's view, and particularly in
22 statute itself calls for an adjudication of the 22 conjunction with the Coercion statute relative
23 underlying veracity of that which is submitted, 23 to prostitution, 796.09, would form a reasonable
24 much less for countervailing evidentiary 24 basis to establish at least a claim for punitive
25 submissions.' 25 damages, recognizing that, again, the courts
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29 31
1 have made clear that the proffer and the burden 1 CERTIFICATE
2 on the moving party is much less than at summary 2
3 judgment or at trial, so I will allow the 3 STATE OF FLORIDA )
amendments to proceed and, therefore, we do have 4 COUNTY OF BROWARD )
5 an amended complaint, so how much time wit you
6
6 need, Mr. Craton, to respond?
7 I, JENNIFER D. DiLORENZO, Shorthand
7 MR. CAUTION: I just wrote to Mr. Berger
a Reporter, certify that I was authorized to and did
a 20 days I would like for both of therm if that's
9 stenographically report the foregoing proceedings and
9 agreeable with the Court.
10 that the transcript is a true and complete record of
10 THE COURT: Fine with me, as king as it's my stenographic notes.
11
11 fine with the Plaintiffs. 12
12 MR. BERGER: Yes, Your Honor. I drafted 13 Dated this 5th day of August, 2009.
13 an order and just showed it to Mr. Critton. It 14
la just says: 'Granted for reasons stated on the 15
15 record. Plaintiff may Me an amended complaint 16
16 to allege a count for battery' - which is also 17
17 part of ow motion, which was unopposed -'and 16
18 punitive damages. The defense shall have 20 19 JENNIFER D. DiLORENZO,
19 days to respond.' COURT REPORTER
20 THE COURT: I believe you already filed 20
21 the proposed amended complaint. 21
22 MR. EDWARDS: Yes, Your Honor. I filed it 22
23 with the motion. 23
24 MR. BERGER: Ill correct that. 24
25 THE COURT: You can indicate in there -- 25
30
1 MR. CRITTON: Deemed filed.
2 THE COURT: -- "the amended complaint
3 shall be deemed filed as of the date of this
4 order from today."
MR. BERGER: We'll draft it out there and
6 present It to the bailiff.
7 THE COURT: Not a problem. Thank you very
8 much. Gentlemen, thank you for your arguments
9 and your submissions and have a good rest of the
10 week.
11 MR. CRITTON: It they get it typed I'll
12 take a copy.
13 (The hearing concluded at 9:05 a.m.)
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
Toll
IN THE CIRCUIT COURT OF THE 15TH JUDICIAL CIRCUIT IN
AND FOR PALM BEACH COUNTY. FLORIDA
Plaintiff.
vs. Case No. 502008CA028058
XXXXMB AD
JEFFREY EPSTEIN,
Defendant.
PROCEEDINGS BEFORE THE
HONORABLE JUDGE DONALD W. HAFELE
July 31, 2009
8:30 a.m.
205 N. Dixie Highway
West Palm Beach, FL 33401
Jennifer DiLorenzo, court reporter
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„MarsaderOstlaC
Fort Lauderdale, FL 33301
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1 3
IN IRS 411=1/ COUNT OF THE ISTE JUDICIAL CIRCUIT IN 1 Proceedings in the Matter OM. vs. JEFFREY EPSTEIN
AND FOR PALM Ma COUNW, MAIM
2 Jtiy 31.2009 8:30
3 THE COURT: Good morning, gentlemen.
4 We're here this morning on the Plaintiffs
Plaintiff, motions to add punitive damages. Who will be
vs. Case R. 302004CA02$05$ 6 arguing on behalf of the Plaintiff?
ICOnNS AD
JEMMY 8087[10,
7 MR. EDWARDS: Brad Edwards, Your Honor.
8 THE COURT: Alright, Mr. Edwards.
Defendant.
9 MR. EDWARDS: Do I need to go to the
10 podium or is right here fine?
P*00493)17106 SirOle /NI
11 THE COURT: Whichever you prefer.
NONORASLC JUDGE DONAID N HAMELIN
12 MR. EDWARDS: Your Honor, with our motion
July 31, 2009 13 we filed - and, I believe. Your Honor has it -
son a.m. - 9,01 a.m.
14 the decovery that was submitted to Mr. Epstein.
205 K. D1Ale IllgANAY 15 which consists of Requests for Admissions.
meet Vela Beta., FL 33101
16 Requests for Production, interrogatories. as
17 well as Interrogatory responses under oath by my
18 client.
19 THE COURT: Do you have any cases that
Jennifer DiLorenin, Court reporter 20 speak to the presumption relative to the
21 Defendant exercising his Fifth and Sixth
22 Amendment rights during the deposition testimony
23 and/or during any other discovery?
24 MR. EDWARDS: Sure, Your Honor.
25 THE COURT: I Wow that Mr. Odeon in his
2 4
1 APPEARANCES OF COUNSEL 3. reply memorandum Indicated some conflict In
2 2 terms of the nature of the discussions of the
3 On behaA of the Plantiff:
4 ROTHSTEIN, ROSENFELDT & ADLER 3 appellate courts relative to that Issue.
BY: WILLIAM J. BERGER, ESO., 4 MR, EDWARDS: May I approach?
5 lamer Park Office Tower
Suite 675 5 THE COURT: Thank you.
6 225 NE Mizner Boulevard 6 MR. EDWARDS: I'm going to present the
Boca Raton, FL 33432 7 case of Fraser vs. Security and Investment out
7 561.322-776t
wbergerenralawcom of the Fourth DOA.
9 The pertinent part, It says: "Our
ROTHSTEIN, ROSENFELDT & ADLER
9 BY: BRADLEY J. EDWARDS. ESQ, 10 conclusion Is consistent with the prevailing
401 East Las Olas Boulevard 11 rule that the Fifth Amendment does not forbid
to Suite 1650
Fort Lauderdale, FL 33394 12 adverse Inferences against parties to civil
13. 954.522.3456 13 actions when they refuse to testify in response
bedwardserna
14 to probative evidence offered against them: the
12
13 On behalf of the Defendant: 15 amendment 'does not preclude the inference where
14 BURMAN, CSIMON, LLITTIER & COLEMAN 16 the privilege Is claimed by a party to a civil
BY: ROBERT D. CANTON, JR., ESO..
15 515 North Rapier Drive 17 cause?
Sotto 400 18 It skips down and says: 'Such a rule is
16 West Palm Beach, FL 33401
19 both logical and utilitarian. A party may not
17 20 trample upon the rights of others and then
18
19 21 escape the consequences by invoking a
20 22 constitutional privilege - at least not In a
21 23 clvii setting."
22
23 24 The final paragraph on that page says:
24 25 'Nor are we persuaded that the fact of
25
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5 7
1 invocation of the privilege is irrelevant and 1 we're not talking about 400, which, I believe.
2 immaterial: 'In the case' -- Sony, 'Mr. 2 is the number known to law enforcement, we are
3 Justice Brandeis... observed that 'Silence Is 3 talking about thousands of children, and it is
4 often evidence of the most persuasive 4 through a very intricate and complicated system
5 character:" that he devised where he has as many as 20
6 Clearly, this case, out of our district 6 people working underneath him that he is paying
7 court. is an indication that adverse inferences 7 well to schedule these appointments, to locate
a may be drawn. 8 these glds.
9 Right now wo are at a punitive damages He particularly goes atter a very
10 stage. We are not at a stage where we are 10 vulnerable and impressionable age group that —
11 talking about the admissibility of evidence. We 11 THE COURT: To use the quotation, 'the
12 are — 12 evidence will show the Defendant sought out
13 THE COURT: Speaking only of a proffer to 13 underprivileged and economically disadvantaged
14 establish punitive damages as required under 14 minor females: and later go on to say,
15 768.721, correct? 15 'influenced them away from the typical
16 MR. EDWARDS: Exactly, and I was going to, 16 adolescent lifestyle as a result of his
17 for the record, read that part of 768.721: "In 17 allegedly criminal acts.'
18 a civi action, there is a" -- 18 MR. EDWARDS: And that is exactly what
19 THE COURT: I think we can skip that. 19 he's done. The age group begins as young as
20 MR. EDWARDS: Okay. 20 12 years old and as old as 16 years old. There
21 THE COURT: The statute speaks for itself 21 will be evidence that at 16 years old, many of
22 and its a part of the record belay, so why 22 the girls are told, 'You're getting too old for
23 don't you go ahead and proceed? 23
24 MR. EDWARDS: The reasonable showing, by 24 He very dearly targets this specific age
25 way of proffer, that there is an Intentional 25 group and has a method to this; that is, "Get
6 8
1 misconduct or gross negligence on behalf of the 1 the girls inside the house and I wiN do the
2 Defendant. 2 rest, and he creates this God-like aura for
3 Intentional misconduct is defined as 'the 3 these girls and --
4 Defendant had actual knowledge of the wrong 4 THE COURT: Let's talk about - pardon me
5 per conduct and the high probabilty for interrupting you - let's talk about the
6 that injury or damage to the claimant would 6 precise deln=at are g made here. You're
7 result and, despite that knowledge, 7 dealing with NMI and theyre pseudonyms
-
8 intentionally pursued that course of conduct for purposes of this litigation. Why don't we
9 resulting in injury or damage.' 9 speak to those two individuals at this juncture
10 In this case, we have intentional 10 and how the punitive damage proffer is
11. misconduct of the worse kind. This is a case 11 sufficient or insufficient relative to them
12 that has been presented to the public through 12 individually, please?
13 public relations people for the Defendant at 13 I understand the global allegations and I
14 times as 'five or six bad under-aged prostitutes 14 understand the allegedly wide scale situation
15 from a high school that. as one of their stops, 15 that you're suggesting as you've alleged here,
16 wound up at Mr. Epstein'S home,' and that's not 16 but I want to go now to the precise claims trade
17 the case at all. 17 by these two Plaintiffs who are in front of the
18 What the evidence is really going to show 18 Court today, and whether or not that proffer is
19 is that Mr. Epstein - at least dating back as 19 sufficient to satisfy the case law, inducing
20 far as our investigation and resources have 20 the case that Mr. Clifton cited, and that is:
21 permitted, back to 1997 or '98 - has every 21 The Estate of Despain, D-E-S-P-A-I-N. vs. Avante
22 single day of his life, made an attempt to 22 Group, Inc., which is found at 900 So.2d. 637,
23 sexually abuse children. 23 and that was a Fifth District Court of Appeal
24 We're not talking about five, we're not 24 case, decided in 2005.
25 talking about 20, we're not talking about 100, 25 MR. EDWARDS: Yes, Your Honor, and that
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the case that states: 'a 'proffer according to 1 the Defendant. I also observed sexual acts and
2 traditional notions of the term, connotes merely 2 had sexual acts perpetrated on me and was forced
3 an 'offer of evidence and neither the term 3 to perform on me. including oral sex and other
4 standing alone nor the statute itself calls for 4 activities. At various times I was unclothed,
5 an adjudication of the underlying veracity...is 5 as was Defendant and others. At all times
6 merely a representation of what evidence the 6 material, I was a child under the age of
7 defendant proposes to present? 7 18 years. I was a victim of various criminal
a We can turn to the sworn Interrogatory 8 acts and sexual exploitation. I was Induced and
9 answers, No. 8, wherein and, similarly, 9 coerced by the Defendant into acts of
10 words, states: 'I 10 prostitution?
Ng, in slightly different
11 was touched, battered, and fondled by Defendant 11 THE COURT: Thank you. You were going to
12 Jeffrey Epstein during the Incidents described 12 speak to a legal point --
13 in the complaint. I observed the Defendant 13 MR. EDWARDS: Right.
14 touch and fondle himself. I observed the 14 THE COURT: — before I asked you to read
15 Defendant ejaculate numerous times. I was made 15 into the record those Interrogatory answers. Go
16 to touch the Defendant. I also observed sexual 16 ahead.
17 acts and had sexual acts perpetrated on me by 17 MR. EDWARDS: Where we left off was the
18 Defendant Jeffrey Epstein. At various times I 18 coercion into prostitution. What makes these
19 was unclothed, as was the Defendant and others. 19 crimes so egregious is the fact that these girls
20 At all times material, I was a child under the 20 that we're talking about were all beginning
21 age of 18 years old. The Defendant also used me 21 their grooming process with Mr. Epstein when
22 to bring him other minor girls and he controlled 22 theyre 14 and 15 and 16 years old.
23 and brainwashed me" -- 23 There is a specific statute, which we have
24 THE COURT: Just a second. 24 filed, and a cause of action under our
25 (Telephone interruption.) 25 complaint, that is under 796.09, Cowden. civil
10 12
1 MR. EDWARDS: "and brainwashed me Into 1 cause of action.
2 believing this lifestyle was healthy and normal 2 Reading 796.09, Paragraph 1: 'A person
3 for a girl my age. I was a victim of various 3 has a cause of action for compensatory and
4 criminal acts and sexual exploitation. I was ♦ punitive damages' - this is in the statute -
5 induced and coerced by Defendant into acts of • 'against a person who coerced them into
6 prostitution' 6 prostitution," and it goes on to define what
7 While we're on the coercion and 7 coercion means, and it is exactly what happened
prostitution, there is a specific — • in this case.
9 THE COURT: Before you move on, thars 9 This statute allows for punitive damages
10 LM.'s -- 10 on a statutory level irrespective of the age of
11 MR. EDWARDS: Yes, Your Honor. 11 the person that is coerced into prostitution.
12 THE COURT: — Answer to IntesTitones? 12 THE COURT: And the coercion that you're
13 Why don't you read into the record 's Answer 13 talking about are the alleged acts as between
14 to Interrogatories so the record is dear? 14 these two Plaintiffs and Mr. Epstein as opposed
15 MR. EDWARDS: I apologize, Your Honor. 15 to, I think, there's something In one of the
16 THE COURT: Take your time. 16 Interrogatories that suggests that there may
17 MR. EDWARDS: Answer to Interrogatory No. 17 have been prostitution that followed, at least
la 8 for.. Indicates: 'My injuries arc 18 one of the Plaintiffs, involvement with Mr.
19 emotional and psychological and are the direct 19 Epstein, but you're speaking solely about the
20 result of Defendant Jeffrey Epstein's actions. 20 prostitution Issues as It concerns the
21 I was touched, battered, and fondled by the 21 Plaintiffs here and Epstein; is that accurate?
22 Defendant during the incidents described in the 22 MR. EDWARDS: I believe, If I understand
23 complaints. I observed the Defendant touch and 23 what you are saying, I mean, In terms of
24 fondle himself. I observed the Defendant 24 damages, if one of the Plaintiffs - and I can
25 ejaculate numerous times. I was made to touch 25 represent - if one of the Plaintiffs was led
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13 15
1 into a life of prostitution after being 1 intentional misconduct and/or gross negligence.
2 indoctrinated into this deviant lifestyle at an 2 I think the record is very dear at this
3 early age by Mr. Epstein - she was not a 3 point, especially after this proffer, that if
4 prostitute prior to that • and I relate that 4 any case is deservant of punitive damages being
5 similar to kids of that age being brought over added, its this one.
6 to somebody's house that is as powerful and 6 THE COURT: AlrigM. Thank you. I'll
7 wealthy as him and he has, let's say, cocaine on 7 give you a couple minutes to wrap up after Mr.
8 the table, and they do that for three years. 8 Critton finishes his argument
They think it's fun at the time. but after that MR. EDWARDS: Thank you, Your Honor.
10 they have this addiction that continues on. 10 THE COURT: Thank you.
11 This Is something similar to what happened to 11 MR. CRITTON: May It please the Court. As
12 one of the clients. 12 the Court knows, I represent Mr. Epstein in this
13 But, yes, the coercion into prostitution 13 matter.
14 is something that on a statutory level already 14 Your Honor, a couple of things to start -
15 allows for punitive damages, and that's 15 the case that Mr. Edwards cites deals with
16 irrespective of the age. 16 inferences, deals with inferences at trial time
17 THE COURT: Again, I'm trying to 17 as distinct from inferences that, I believe, are
18 understand the factual basis. There's 18 sufficient to catty the day, so-to-speak, in the
19 allegations that Mr. Epstein paid these young 19 absence of other evidence with Mr. Epstein's
20 ladies $200 to massage him and then subsequent 20 claim of Fifth Amendment privilege, As well, we
21 thereto, there was some type of alleged sexual 21, cited to the court cases - and I'll get to in
22 activity. Are you speaking to that specifically 22 just a minute - that specifically address that
23 when you're talking about the statutory remedy 23 issue.
24 or are you speaking about something distinct 24 Secondly, we're not here on - and I think
25 from that? 25 the Court, I think, I kind of at least got the
14 16
1 MR. EDWARDS: No, theta specifically what 1 drift is we're not here on other claims - we're
2 I am talking about — 2 here on ■. and ■.'s claim today to add
3 THE COURT: Okay. 3 punitive damages and, In fact, 'Do they meet the
4 MR. EDWARDS: -- Mr. Epstein paying them 4 standard under the applicable statute in this
5 arid using their age, their economic - their lack 5 instance?
6 of wealth - the fact that these are poor, 6 What I think Is the most striking part
7 disadvantaged children with very NW parental 7 about this - and while I believe that the
guidance to his advantage to induce them Into 8 evidence may be - their perception, the
9 acts of prostitution. 9 Plaintiffs' perception of the evidence - may be
10 THE COURT: II give you two minutes to 10 afferent than ourselves, but I think the
11 wrap up, please. 11 evidence in this case will show, at least ■.
12 MR. EDWARDS: Okay. 12 and ■., were prostitutes before they ever met
13 Your Honor while I know that we are 13 Mr. Epstein, they remain prostitutes, and they
14 focusing on and there are certain 3.4 are still prostitutes today.
15 defenses that have been made such as. 'The girls 15 THE COURT: But is my role today one of
16 were' - "we didn't know that they were over 18, 16 weighing the evidence or one of determining
17 otherwise we wouldn't have done this,' where we 17 whether or not there's a sufficient record In
18 are going to be able to show there are hundreds 18 order to allow a punitive damage claim to stand?
19 and hundreds and hundreds of girls and none of 19 I mean, in one of the cases, I believe -
20 them were over the age of 18. 20 it's the case of State of Wisconsin Investment
21 Many of these girls, including my clients. 21 Board vs. Plantation Square Associates, that's
22 told him that they were under the age of 18 and 22 found at 761 F.Supp 1569 - Judge Hugler
23 he continued to do this misconduct, which Is 23 (phonetic) of the federal court provided an
24 exactly what the statute or what the punitive 24 excellent discussion of the distinction between
25 damages statute speaks to when it talks about 25 the proofs necessary to sustain a claim for
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punitive damages oven at summary judgment, much 1 FBI agent and a U.S. attorney that was there at
2 less a trial, and compared that with the 2 the time - and she talked about going over to
3 relatively lighter burden of simply making a 3 Mr. Epstein's house. She said, "I had a fake
4 proffer of record evidence to support a claim ID." She was told to make certain that she was
for punitive damages. 5 18. She told Mr. Epstein she was 18, and she
6 MR CANTON: Right 6 said it was her understanding that all of the
7 THE COURT: Aren't we at that stage: that 7 other girls that she brought for this horrific
a Is, the latter stage right now? 8 experience - she continued to bring other girls
9 MR. CFUTTON: Yes, and I very well 9 and go herself on a number of occasions.
10 understand the distinction and. I believe. I 10 She said that she, herself -- On Page 8,
11 understand what the Court's rote is in this 11 it asks, "Did she ever call you?" - and I assume
12 particular Instance In making that 12 that was someone else - and she goes. 'No. I
13 determination. 13 gave Jeffrey my number and, I said, you know, if
14 A coupe of the issues though, In 14 you want me to give you a massage again,
:5 particular • with a camera hero today. for some 15 basically I'm more than anxious to come:
16 unknown reason, showing up at this hearing - is 16 On Page 9, gi says, "I willingly took' -
17 there were references to drugs, alcohol, other 17 'so I willingly, the first time, took off my top
18 instances that are not applicable to this case. 18 when I gave him the massage and nothing more
:9 There's no pleadings on that particular issue, 19 than that:
20 and I'm concerned about that, is that there's an 20 She goes on to say in her testimony at
21 attempt to jack this up in the media, as I said, 21 Page 10, her sworn statement, "I said, I told
22 with the camera here today, for no other 22 Jeffrey, 'I heard that you like massages
23 hearing. Ks ridiculous under the 23 topless.'"
24 circumstances, and to make all of these wild 24 "And he said like, yeah.' He said, 'But
25 allegations against Mr. Epstein for which there 25 you don't have to do anything that you don't
18 20
1 is absolutely no evidentiary proof nor was that 1 feel comfortable with.'
2 submitted here in support of their proffer, I 2 "And I said. 'Okay,' but I willingly took
3 did want to address at that. 3 it off' - this is. at the time. This is her
4 So let me get to the heart of the issue. 4 sworn testimony.
5 I think the most distinguishing part of this 5 At Page 17, the police officer or the FBI
6 it
particular case that's different; that is, 6 agent says, "and when he turned over then did he
7 and is the tact that II. gave a sworn 7 touch you at all or was he just' Her answer
8 statement to the FBI in this instance. was, "No. I did not touch him. he did not touch
9 Again, there's a strong distinction. She 9 me. He didn't even want.." and I assume to
10 gave a sworn statement back in '05 or In '06. 10 'touch you'
11 She had - did - she had an attorney, Mr. 11 She goes on to say, 'He didn't want me to
12 Eisenberg, it was before she had a civil lawyer 12 touch him and he didn't touch me.'
13 who's seeking millions of dollars under these 13 She goes on and on in this statement,
14 circumstances, and the testimony of.. at that 14 .., In the statement and she says, 'We had
15 time was very significant and It flies direcily 15
16 In the face of her 'sworn testimony' or her 16 'It was positive,' on Page 18.
17 "sworn interrogatories.' 17 On Page 19, 'You know, I would wear
18 The Court had Mr. Edwards read inn's 18 panties. Willingly one time, because wo were
19 answer and M.'s answer to their 19 making jokes and everything, and willingly one
20 Interrogatories as to what a6egedly occurred 20 time, I had, yes, I was totally nude, but I was
23. with Mr. Epstein and, 'Oh, surprise,' they were 21 fine with that.'
22 almost verbatim, word for word, as to what 22 She talks about within the statement the
23 allegedly happened. 23 other girls that she brought over. Again, she's
24 But at the time of her sworn statement to 24 testified or she gives the Interrogatory answer
25 the FBI.. said on 4/24/07 - again, it was an 25 that this was outrageous to her, but, yet she
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21. 23
brought other girls to experience this. She 1 and.. in their Answers to
2 says - now that she has a civil lawyer seeking 2 Interrogatories have made all sorts of, what we
3 money damages - now 'it's a bad experience." 3 believe In part, are baseless or In large part
4 Now all of a sudden. "He touched me, he did 4 baseless alleations, but we also have sworn
these things to me.' 5 testimony off.. on this instance.
6 She references - at least, on Page 29 of 6 We don't have it of.., but we have..
7 the statement, Judge - there's a 'W" that's 7 testifying about her own experience under oath:
a referenced. "W' I would represent to bell. In That it was positive; that he never used force,
9 the . complaint, and I think we established 9 that she willingly did a number of times
10 that when Mr. Berger and I were a aT! ng a prior 10 including giving topless massages; that Mr.
11 molten to you. So she talks about.. on Page 11 Epstein never touched her; that she never
12 29. 12 touched him inappropriately, all she did was
33 That's when she starts saying, she says, 13 basically give him massages; that.., in this
14 TUT - "she; meaning.., 'was my baby's 14 instance, as well as all the other girls that
15 father's girlfriend al the time' 15 she took, she spoke with them afterwards, they
16 Then on Page 30, "How old wasS? 16 begged to go back to Mr. Epstein's home, and
17 the was 17." 17 none of them, not one of them ever complained.
18 Alright, so you have 12, 13, 14, 15, 16. 18 So there's a large chasm between what is
19 You haves. saying 'W" was 17 at the time. 19 now being asserted In Answers to Interrogatories
20 "And what happened when W came over?' 20 and mere allegations In the complaint between
21 She said the same thing. "She went a few 21 what the sworn testimony, at least., was
22 times.' 22 under the circumstances, as it relates to
23 On Page 31,n testified under oath to 23 herself and what she was told by.. and other
24 the FBI and the United Slates attorii:None of 24 girls.
25 my girls ever had a problem. And NM call 25 Thank you, Your Honor.
22 24
1 me. They begged me, you know, for us to go to 1 THE COURT: Thank you.
2 Jeffrey's house because they loved Jeffrey. 2 Mr. Edwards, Ill give you a couple
3 Jeffrey is a respectful man, he really Is. I 3 minutes here.
4 mean, he all thought we were of age, always, 4 MR. EDWARDS: Your Honor, I want to
that's what's so sad about it.' 5 address the statement that was made by.. to
6 And she goes on, Page 36, and the FBI says 6 the FBI and how that even came about. This is a
to her, 'Now, when you were working for him, you 7 girl who, at the time of the statement, was
8 were going over to Jeffrey's house to give him 8 faith/ unaware of the investigation against Mr.
9 massages, did you have a boyfriend? 9 Epstein, who is now, as we know, a convicted sex
10 10 offender.
11 'And how did your boyfriend feel about 11 An attorney showed up to her house, paid
12 it?" 12 for by Mr. Epstein, to represent her despite -
13 'He was" --S. says, 'He was a Jealous 13 and told her that, "For your role, you could
14 little boy, but he didn't care, 'Bring home the 14 possibly be implicated In some wrongdoing.'
15 bacon,'" and the statement goes on and on, Your 15 MR. CRITTON: Your Honor, just —
16 Honor. I know you've had an opportunity read It 16 MR. EDWARDS: He represent —
17 before and I reference again today. 17 MR. CRITTON: -- note my (Medial. This
18 There's clearly a distinction conflict 18 Is complete hearsay here. He was aware of what
19 between., now that she has a civil lawyer 19 was filed. He didn't file any affidavits for
20 and she wants money, versus at the time that she 20 his client in opposition. I would object to any
21 didn't want money and she gave a statement under 21 of this.
22 oath to the FBI and the United States attorney's 22 THE COURT: Alright. I don't want to get
23 office. 23 Into any of the details. I don't third( it's
24 I recognize the Court's rote in this. I 24 necessary at this juncture, which probably leads
25 recognize the standard. I recognize that both 25 me to my question to you; that Is: Is the
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weighing of evidence appropriate at this 1 The Court finds that, while I appreciate
2 juncture? 2 Mr. Critton's argument and while I appreciate
3 MR. EDWARDS: No, Your Honor, I don't 3 his submission, that essentially at this stage.
4 believe that's the standard at this stage 4 respectfully, he is, at this point, presenting
anyway, and I don't think that Mr. Craton 5 countervailing evidentiary submissions.
6 believes that either. 6 The Court further goes on in paraphrasing
7 Just so the record's clear, we had nothing 7 and then directly quoting Judge Hugler
8 to do with the video camera being here, although 'Therefore a proffer is merely a representation
that was implied. I don't know who did. 9 of what evidence the defendant proposes to
10 don't know it it was Mr. Critton, but it wasn't 10 present and is not actual evidence' Actually,
IL me. 11 that's a quote from prim vs. State. 841 So.2d.
12 THE COURT: Dan is always welcome here. 12 455, 462, and that, I believe, is a Florida
13 MR. EDWARDS: It's perfectly fine, but I 13 Supreme Court case, even though the citation
14 don't Ike that being on the record, that it 14 itself is not complete.
15 looks Ike I did it when I didn't. 15 It goes on to say importantly - and that
16 THE COURT: I understand. We have a 16 is in the Despain case -'A reasonable showing
17 record here. The official record Is being taken 17 by evidence in the record would typically
18 down by our fine court reporter. so. 18 include depositions, interrogatories, and
19 MR. EDWARDS: Either way, sounds like what 19 requests for admissions that have been filed
20 we just heard, that the reason that punitive 20 with the court. Hence, an evidentiary hearing
21 should not be allowed here is because these 21 where witnesses testify and evidence is offered
22 14-year-old girls did this willingly. 22 and scrutinized under the pertinent evidentiary
23 We know that they're 14 years old, Mr. 23 rules, as in a trial, is neither contemplated
24 Cotton knows they were 14, 15 year olds. There 24 nor mandated by the statute in order to
25 were message pads and scheduling books in 25 determine whether a reasonable basis has been
26 28
1 Epstein's possession indicating the dates, which 1 established to plead punitive damages,' and I'll
2 would show how old those girls were, and that's 2 admit this citation from the Fifth District
3 evidence that will be presented in this case. 3 Court of Appeal, but, again, that is cited in
4 There aro serious statutes to protect 4 Despain.
5 these kids from this kind of conduct, and these 5 Likewise, in Strasser vs. Yalarnanchl, 677
6 second and third degree felonies were committed 6 Sold. 22, which is a Florida Fourth District
7 repeatedly against them, and this is a case 7 Court of Appeal case from 1996, which is one of
13 where, at least in a civil case, punitive 8 the parar$gm cases on the proffering of punitive
9 damages are warranted, Your Honor. 9 damage evidence, that states that 'there was
10 Thank you, Your Honor. 10 reasonable basis for recovery of punitive
11 THE COURT: Thank you both. I'm going to 11 damages' can be demonstrated by either a
12 grant the motion. In conformance with and 12 presentation of supporting evidence already in
13 following the Despain case, the Court indicates, 13 the record or by a proffer of the evidence to
14 in following the analysis of Judge Hugler - and, 14 COMO.
15 by the way, that analysis of Judge Hugler is 15 I find that a combination of the Answers
16 commented upon on a supportive basis by several 16 to Interrogatories - I will take into account.
17 appellate courts - and in the Despain case under 17 though, give little weight to the Fifth
18 headnote 7 and 8 on Page 642 it states: 'a 18 Amendment arguments of Plaintiffs - but
19 'proffer according to traditional notions of 19 certainly the Answers to Interrogatories on
20 the term, connotes merely an 'offers of evidence 20 behalf of both of these Individual Plaintiffs in
21 and neither the term standing alone nor the 21 this Court's view, and particularly in
22 statute itself calls for an adjudication of the 22 conjunction with the Coercion statute relative
23 underlying veracity of that which is submitted, 23 to prostitution, 796.09, would form a reasonable
24 much less for countervailing evidentiary 24 basis to establish at least a claim for punitive
25 submissions.' 25 damages, recognizing that, again, the courts
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July 31, 2009
Proceedings
29 31
1 have made clear that the proffer and the burden 1 CERTIFICATE
2 on the moving party is much less than at summary 2
3 judgment or at trial, so I will allow the 3 STATE OF FLORIDA )
amendments to proceed and, therefore, we do have 4 COUNTY OF BROWARD )
5 an amended complaint, so how much time wit you
6
6 need, Mr. Craton, to respond?
7 I, JENNIFER D. DiLORENZO, Shorthand
7 MR. CAUTION: I just wrote to Mr. Berger
a Reporter, certify that I was authorized to and did
a 20 days I would like for both of therm if that's
9 stenographically report the foregoing proceedings and
9 agreeable with the Court.
10 that the transcript is a true and complete record of
10 THE COURT: Fine with me, as king as it's my stenographic notes.
11
11 fine with the Plaintiffs. 12
12 MR. BERGER: Yes, Your Honor. I drafted 13 Dated this 5th day of August, 2009.
13 an order and just showed it to Mr. Critton. It 14
la just says: 'Granted for reasons stated on the 15
15 record. Plaintiff may Me an amended complaint 16
16 to allege a count for battery' - which is also 17
17 part of ow motion, which was unopposed -'and 16
18 punitive damages. The defense shall have 20 19 JENNIFER D. DiLORENZO,
19 days to respond.' COURT REPORTER
20 THE COURT: I believe you already filed 20
21 the proposed amended complaint. 21
22 MR. EDWARDS: Yes, Your Honor. I filed it 22
23 with the motion. 23
24 MR. BERGER: Ill correct that. 24
25 THE COURT: You can indicate in there -- 25
30
1 MR. CRITTON: Deemed filed.
2 THE COURT: -- "the amended complaint
3 shall be deemed filed as of the date of this
4 order from today."
MR. BERGER: We'll draft it out there and
6 present It to the bailiff.
7 THE COURT: Not a problem. Thank you very
8 much. Gentlemen, thank you for your arguments
9 and your submissions and have a good rest of the
10 week.
11 MR. CRITTON: It they get it typed I'll
12 take a copy.
13 (The hearing concluded at 9:05 a.m.)
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