EFTA00118226.pdf

1 DIGITALLY RECORDED SWORN STATEMENT OF TOVA NOEL OIG CASE #: 2019-010614 DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE OFFICE OF THE INSPECTOR GENERAL JUNE 21, 2021 RESOLUTE DOCUMENTATION SERVICES EFTA00118226  2 APPEARANCES: OFFICE OF THE INSPECTOR GENERAL BY: BY: WITNESS: TOVA NOEL OTHER APPEARANCES: JASON FOY, ESQ. ERIC SARRAGA, ESQ. EFTA00118227  3 1 MR. : The recorder is on. My 2 name is . I am a Senior 3 Special Agent with the U.S. Department of 4 Justice Office of the Inspector General New 5 York Field Office and these are my credentials. 6 This interview with Federal Bureau of Prisons 7 correctional officer Tova Noel is being 8 conducted as part of an official U.S. 9 Department of Justice Office of the Inspector 10 General investigation. Today's date is June 11 22, 2021 and the time is 10:09 a.m. This 12 interview is being conducted at - what is the 13 location - 15 -? 14 MR. FOY: 15 16 MR. : Thank you, sir. 17 MR. FOY: Bergen County Bar Association, 18 second floor conference room. 19 MR. : Okay. 20 MR. FOY: By the way, that was Jason Foy 21 speaking. 22 MR. : Yes. Also present are 23 DOJ OIG Special Agent -; 24 Correctional officer Tova Noel; Ms. Noel's 25 attorneys, Jason Foy, and Eric Sarraga of Foy & EFTA00118228  4 1 Seplowitz, LLC; as well as union representative 2 of the Local 3149 with the BOP. 3 This interview will be recorded by me, Senior 4 Special Agent . Could 5 everyone please identify themselves for the 6 record and spell your last name. To start, 7 again, I am DOJ OIG Senior Special Agent 8 , M-A-T-U-L-I-W-I-C-Z. 9 MR. : I am DOJ OIG Special Agent 10 D-A-N-I-I-L. 11 MS. NOEL: I'm Tova Noel, N-O-I-L. 12 MR. FOY: Jason Foy, F-O-Y, attorney for 13 Tova Noel. 14 MR. SARRAGA: Eric Sarraga, S-A-R-R-A-G-A, 15 attorney for Tova Noel. 16 MS. , G-R-I-G-G, Local 17 3148. 18 MR. : Thank you everyone. Ms. 19 Noel, you are here today as a subject in this 20 DOJ OIG investigation. This DOJ OIG 21 investigation concerns your alleged misconduct 22 to include allegations of false statements, job 23 performance failure, security failure, and 24 reporting false information. This is an 25 official DOJ OIG investigation and you are EFTA00118229  5 1 being asked to voluntarily provide answers to 2 our questions. Will you agree to a voluntary 3 interview with the DOJ OIG? 4 MS. NOEL: Yes. 5 MR. : Alright. Great. And 6 then everyone that does voluntary interviews 7 with the DOJ we provide them with these 8 voluntary interview forms. I don't know if you 9 guys were sent that at the time, but it says, 10 "United States Department of Justice Office of 11 the Inspector General, Warnings and Assurances 12 to Employee Requested to Provide Information on 13 a Voluntary Basis. You are being asked to 14 provide information as part of an investigation 15 being conducted by the Office of the Inspector 16 General. This investigation is being conducted 17 pursuant to the Inspector General Act of 1978 18 as amended. This investigation pertains to 19 your alleged misconduct to include allegations 20 of false statements, job performance failure, 21 security failure, and reporting false 22 information. This is a voluntary interview. 23 Accordingly, you do not have to answer 24 questions. No disciplinary action will be 25 taken against you if you choose not to answer EFTA00118230  6 1 questions. Any statement you furnish may be 2 used as evidence in any future criminal 3 proceeding or agency disciplinary proceedings 4 or both. And of course, there's the DPA 5 waiver. I understand the warnings and 6 assurances stated above and I am willing to 7 make a statement or answer questions. No 8 promises or threats have been made to me and no 9 pressure or coercion of any kind has been used 10 against me. You can take a look at this and 11 review it. If you agree, there's a section 12 there for your name and signature. 13 MR. FOY: So the only thing that this is 14 actually subject to is the deferred prosecution 15 agreement. 16 MR. : Well so there's the 17 agreement that you had, so that's the part 18 where I'm talking about the specific part where 19 it says criminal. 20 MR. FOY: Mm-hmm. 21 MR. : That's something I think 22 that was worked out with the U.S. Attorney's 23 Office -- 24 MR. FOY: Right. Exactly. 25 MR. : So -. EFTA00118231  7 1 MR. FOY: I know there's no sort of 2 protection with regard to the disciplinary 3 internally the administrative thing that -- 4 MR. : Correct. 5 MR. FOY: -- will happen at some point. 6 But I just wanted to make that clear. But go 7 ahead, you can sign Tova. 8 MR. : Now obviously, that is 9 pursuant to you answering questions truthfully. 10 MR. FOY: Right. Of course. That's the 11 exception to our agreement. 12 MR. : There's a line that says 13 employee signature. 14 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 15 MR. : Alright. And the rest 16 will be filled out by the two of us. 17 MR. FOY: Okay. 18 MR. : Thank you, sir. 19 MR. FOY: Yep. 20 MR. : And thank you for signing 21 Ms. Noel. Alright. So I'm going to sign where 22 it says signature of the Office of the 23 Inspector General Special Agent. Again, this 24 is . I'm printing my name. 25 And Special Agent can you fill out the EFTA00118232  8 1 rest for signature of witness, name of witness, 2 date, time, and place. 3 MR. : This is Agent signing 4 on the signature of witness. 5 MR. : And then do you understand 6 the form as you read and you review? 7 MS. NOEL: Yes, I do. 8 MR. : Great. Thank you. 9 Before starting the interview, I'd like to 10 place you under oath. Can you please raise 11 your right hand? Do you swear to tell the 12 truth and nothing but the truth during this 13 interview? 14 MS. NOEL: Yes, sir. 15 MR. : Thank you, Ma'am. 16 Alright. Please let me know if you do not 17 understand any of my questions. I'll try to 18 rephrase or ask it a different way. 19 MS. NOEL: Okay. 20 MR. : Alright. So this is 21 something we ask everybody. Do you - what's 22 your current home address? 23 MS. NOEL: 24 25 MR. : Thank you. What's your EFTA00118233  9 1 date of birth? 2 MS. NOEL: 3 MR. : And your last four of 4 your Social Security number. 5 MS. NOEL: 6 MR. : Thank you. What's your 7 highest level of education? 8 MS. NOEL: A bachelor's degree. 9 MR. : And what was your 10 bachelor's degree in? 11 MS. NOEL: Criminal justice (Indiscernible 12 *00:06:14) in law. 13 MR. : And where did you receive 14 that degree from? 15 MS. NOEL: John Jay. 16 MR. : John Jay in New York 17 City? 18 MS. NOEL: Yes, sir. 19 MR. : And when did you 20 graduate? 21 MS. NOEL: 2017. 22 MR. : Thank you. What did you 23 do - just briefly - prior to working with the 24 BOP? 25 MS. NOEL: Prior to working with the BOP I EFTA00118234  10 1 worked at the Post Office. 2 MR. : Okay. What did you do 3 there? 4 MS. NOEL: I was a mail handler. 5 MR. : And for how long? 6 MS. NOEL: Uh, six months. 7 MR. : Six months? 8 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 9 MR. : And that was in 2016, 10 2016? When did you do that? 11 MS. NOEL: Yes. 12 MR. : 2015 and 2016? 13 MS. NOEL: No. At the post office, I was 14 there 2017. 15 MR. : Oh 2017. 16 MS. NOEL: '16, '17. Mm-hmm. 17 MR. : Oh, okay. And do you 18 have any military service? 19 MS. NOEL: Yes. 20 MR. : And what is that? 21 MS. NOEL: Military service? 22 MR. : Yeah. Can you tell me 23 what the service? 24 MS. NOEL: The Army. 25 MR. : Army. And how long were EFTA00118235  11 1 you in the Army? 2 MS. NOEL: Six years. 3 MR. : From when until when? 4 MS. NOEL: 2008 to 2014. 5 MR. : And what did you do with 6 the military? 7 MS. NOEL: I was a patient administrative 8 specialist. 9 MR. : And what is that? 10 MS. NOEL: Patient admin. 11 MR. : Patient as in like a 12 hospital? 13 MS. NOEL: Yes. 14 MR. : Okay. So you worked in a 15 hospital. And what was your rank when you left 16 the military? 17 MS. NOEL: E4 Specialist. 18 MR. : And did you leave - were 19 you honorably discharged? 20 MS. NOEL: Yes. 21 MR. : Okay. 22 MR. FOY: Can I - one second real quick? 23 For the post office, you said 16 - 17 but you 24 started MCC in 18. 25 MS. NOEL: Yeah. EFTA00118236  12 1 MR. FOY: So would it be 17 into 18? 2 MS. NOEL: 18 yeah. 3 MR. : Oh you did start with the 4 BOP in '18? 5 MS. NOEL: Yes. 6 MR. : Not in '16? 7 MS. NOEL: No. That was an error in the 8 (Indiscernible *00:07:49). 9 MR. FOY: Right. So it's '18, then she 10 left the Post Office in '17, going to - so I 11 think it's 16 -. No 17 - 18. 12 MS. NOEL: '18 - Mm-hmm. 13 MR. FOY: Post Office. Then MCC. 14 MR. : Okay. And did you work 15 for anybody prior or in between your military 16 service and the post office? 17 MS. NOEL: No. 18 MR. : No? Okay. 19 MS. NOEL: Hm-mm. 20 MR. : So you were unemployed at 21 that time? 22 MS. NOEL: No I was going to school. 23 MR. : Oh that's when you went 24 to John Jay. 25 MS. NOEL: That's when I was going to John EFTA00118237  13 1 Jay. Yeah. 2 MR. : Okay. Thank you. And 3 when was your Enter on Duty Date with BOP? 4 MS. NOEL: June 24, 2018. 5 MR. : Okay. And when did you 6 graduate from BOP training down at the Federal 7 Law Enforcement Training Center? 8 MS. NOEL: Um, I want to say September of 9 2018. 10 MR. : Okay. But you did 11 graduate from there? 12 MS. NOEL: Yes, I did. 13 MR. : That was a correctional 14 officer training? 15 MS. NOEL: Yes. 16 MR. : Alright. And when and 17 where was your first office assignment with the 18 BOP? 19 MS. NOEL: Say that again? 20 MR. : When and where was your 21 first office assignment with the BOP? So where 22 did you start - did you start working in MCC 23 and work there the entire time? 24 MS. NOEL: Yes, sir. 25 MR. : Okay. And what positions EFTA00118238  14 1 have you held with the BOP? 2 MS. NOEL: Correctional officer. 3 MR. : Okay. The entire time? 4 MS. NOEL: Yes, sir. 5 MR. : Alright. And when you 6 were there last, who did you report to? Who 7 was your direct supervisor? Or did you have 8 one? 9 MS. NOEL: 10 MR. : And do you know how to 11 spell that last name? 12 MS. NOEL: 13 MR. : Thank you. What is your 14 current -? Again, this is something we ask 15 everybody. We won't be contacting your client. 16 But what is your current cell phone number? 17 MS. NOEL: 18 MR. : Okay. And how long have 19 you had that number? 20 MS. NOEL: Years. 21 MR. : Years. 22 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 23 MR. : So for a long time. 24 MS. NOEL: Yes. 25 MR. : And to include in 2019? EFTA00118239  15 1 MS. NOEL: Yes. 2 MR. : Okay. Any other cell 3 phone numbers? 4 MS. NOEL: No. 5 MR. Okay. And your current 6 email address? 7 MS. NOEL: Um, 8 MR. Okay. Great. And have 9 you had that one also for years? 10 MS. NOEL: Yes. 11 MR. : Okay. Any others? 12 MS. NOEL: Yes. 13 MR. : What are the others? 14 MS. NOEL: Uh, 15 MR. : Same? 16 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 17 MR. : You've had that for 18 years? 19 MS. NOEL: Yes. 20 MR. : Okay. Both in 2019? 21 MS. NOEL: Yes. 22 MR. : Okay. Thank you. Um, do 23 you have any current -? I should have asked 24 this. Are you currently employed right now? 25 MS. NOEL: No. EFTA00118240  16 1 MR. By no other means? 2 MS. NOEL: No. 3 MR. : Okay. And when did you 4 last work at the MCC? 5 MS. NOEL: August 10, 2019. 6 MR. : And was that the same 7 supervisor that you mentioned? 8 MS. NOEL: Yes. 9 MR. : Okay. Briefly, what 10 training have you attended or conducted during 11 your employment with the BOP? You mentioned 12 the correctional officer training at FLETC. 13 What other trainings have they provided for 14 you? 15 MS. NOEL: Um, their two-week training 16 when you first start at BOP. I forget what 17 it's called. IF training. Yes. 18 MR. : IF training? 19 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 20 MR. : And any other training? 21 MS. NOEL: No. 22 MR. : Annual refresher 23 training? 24 MS. NOEL: I have one. 25 MR. : Okay. So you've gone to EFTA00118241  17 1 annual. And what about like a SHU training 2 course? 3 MS. NOEL: No. 4 MR. : Okay. But you did - and 5 this is just - you guys can take a look at this 6 if you would like. This is the training that 7 we have for you. That we asked for your list 8 of training. I'm not asking you to necessarily 9 verify that you've conducted all of it, but it 10 shows the last time you did your annual 11 training was on 3/8/2019 was when you actually 12 completed that week of training. 13 MS. NOEL: Yes. 14 MR. : Does that sound correct? 15 MS. NOEL: Correct. 16 MR. : Again, this just goes 17 along with it. It shows -. It shows what the 18 syllabus was as well as the sign-in sheet where 19 Ms. Noel signed in. Again, it's - we're not 20 asking to you -. 21 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 22 MR. : For - if you want to take 23 a look at it you can. It just shows that you 24 did that training in March of 2019. And 25 anything that I'm going to provide to you, can EFTA00118242  18 1 you just initial and date? And that's just a 2 way for us to verify that that's what we showed 3 you. 4 MS. NOEL: Okay. 5 MR. FOY: Each page or just to top? 6 MR. : Nope, just the top of 7 each page. 8 MR. FOY: Okay. Is (Indiscernible 9 *00:12:34)? 10 MR. : No, you do have that. So 11 just briefly, you don't have to like list off 12 the course syllabus. But what did they cover 13 during that annual training? 14 MS. NOEL: Um they spoke about different 15 areas like dealing with inmates. They spoke 16 about the issues on the job like dealing with 17 shortages. They spoke about um, basically like 18 mask fitted I remember. 19 MR. : Mask fitting? 20 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 21 MR. : Was that back in 2019? 22 People were wearing masks as well? 23 MS. NOEL: No like um. 24 MR. : It's for OC's sprays? 25 MR. : Oh, for OC spray. EFTA00118243  19 1 MS. NOEL: Yes. 2 MR. : Okay. Did they include 3 things like ethics, standards of conduct? 4 MS. NOEL: Yes. 5 MR. : Okay. What about like 6 counts and rounds? 7 MS. NOEL: I don't recall them talking 8 about counts and rounds. 9 MR. : Okay. So did they go 10 over like MCC policies and guidance? 11 MS. NOEL: Yes. 12 MR. : Okay. And did they ever 13 provide you with the policies and guidelines or 14 did they just speak to you about it? 15 MS. NOEL: For in this training? 16 MR. : Yes. 17 MS. NOEL: They just spoke about it. 18 MR. : At another time did they 19 provide you with the polices and guidelines? 20 MS. NOEL: Yeah. It's on like the 21 computer. 22 MR. : Okay. 23 MS. NOEL: The -. 24 MR. : Do you have to certify 25 that you've like received it and you reviewed EFTA00118244  20 1 it? Polices and guidelines? 2 MS. NOEL: I think I signed that like you 3 receive it. 4 MR. : Right. Okay. If you 5 don't mind, just -. 6 MR. FOY: You want it in the lower right? 7 MR. : Doesn't matter. Top or 8 bottom. You know wherever there's room. I 9 typically do top, but bottom is totally fine. 10 MR. FOY: This one, that one. 11 MR. : Today's date is June 22nd. 12 MR. FOY: That's part of the same 13 document. 14 MS. NOEL: Hm. 15 MR. FOY: And just the top page. 16 MR. : And now you mentioned 17 that you didn't quite remember them going over 18 training when conducting counts and rounds in 19 this training. Did you - were you - did you 20 ever receive training on conducting counts and 21 rounds? 22 MS. NOEL: Yes. 23 MR. : Okay. When would that 24 have been? 25 MS. NOEL: In an IF training. EFTA00118245  21 1 MR. : And what does IF stand 2 for? 3 MS. NOEL: Hm. 4 MS. : You want some clarity? I can 5 tell you 6 MR. : Sure. 7 MS. : -- just what it stands for. 8 Institution Familiarization training. 9 MR. : Okay. Great. And that's 10 something that the MCC provided directly? 11 MS. NOEL: Yes. 12 MR. : Okay. Great. And then 13 you had mentioned - did you ever receive 14 policies on counts and rounds? 15 MS. NOEL: No. 16 MR. : I know you said you 17 certified. Do you remember that specific 18 policy - like receiving that? 19 MS. NOEL: Like specifically on counts and 20 rounds? 21 MR. : I'm not asking you to 22 like verbatim tell me what it was. I'm just 23 saying like were you provided and you reviewed 24 it. DO you remember? 25 MS. NOEL: Not specifically on counts and EFTA00118246  22 1 rounds. Just like a general - 2 MR. : Right. 3 MS. NOEL: Like -. 4 MR. : Like you know the housing 5 orders or unit policies and things like that. 6 When you're supposed to conduct counts, when 7 you're supposed to do rounds, that type of 8 thing. 9 MS. NOEL: The post orders. 10 MR. : Post orders. Right. 11 Okay. Great. You mentioned you didn't 12 remember ever going to quarterly SHU training. 13 This is a sign-in sheet for quarterly SHU 14 training. I just want to -. Is this your 15 signature on there for June 26, 2019? 16 MS. NOEL: You see how I'm the last one on 17 the bottom of all of them? 18 MR. : Correct. 19 MS. NOEL: Because I wasn't at the 20 training when I came 21 MR. : Did they provide it to 22 you one-on-one though? 23 MS. NOEL: No. 24 MR. : So how come -? 25 MS. NOEL: Because when I came back from EFTA00118247  23 1 an injury, the lieutenant asked me to sign 2 because when they had program review, they need 3 to show that I received the training. But I 4 never did. She just asked me to sign. That's 5 why I wonder why. 6 MR. : Who asked you to do that? 7 MS. NOEL: 8 MR. : So that supervisor you 9 mentioned was your first line supervisor asked 10 you sign without providing you the training? 11 MS. NOEL: Yes. 12 MR. : And she didn't' like 13 provide you anything to review? 14 MS. NOEL: No. 15 MR. : She didn't go over 16 anything with you? 17 MS. NOEL: No. 18 MR. : Did you discuss this with 19 her - that how can you sign something without 20 being provided the training? 21 MS. NOEL: Well I just told her I wasn't 22 here. I was out on an injury. She said she 23 knows but she needed me to sign it because they 24 need it for program review. 25 MR. : What's her first name? EFTA00118248  24 1 MS. NOEL: 2 MR. : And is she a lieutenant? 3 MS. NOEL: She's a - I don't know what she 4 is now. But she's not at MCC anymore. She's 5 at somewhere in Jersey. 6 MS. : I'm sorry. Before you go, are 7 you done with that question? 8 MR. : Actually, let me um, I 9 didn't do this. 10 MS. : Because I want to 11 (Indiscernible *00:17:14) 12 MR. : And I did forget to do 13 this. There's an advisory to the union 14 representative. 15 MS. : Mm-hmm. 16 MR. : Can you review this? And 17 I do apologize. But since you're speaking up a 18 little bit, let me hand this to you. and then 19 you can review that. And then if you want to 20 just take a look. After you're done reviewing, 21 you may sign it if you agree. 22 MS. • : Will you be able to give me a 23 copy of it? 24 MR. : Yes. I think it says on 25 there that we will forward you a copy of that. EFTA00118249  25 1 MS. : I didn't even see that part. 2 MR. : Should I continue asking 3 questions while she's reviewing that or do you 4 want to wait? 5 MR. FOY: Yeah, you can ask questions. 6 Absolutely. 7 MR. : Sure. So there's another 8 training that you - it says that you conducted 9 on also June 26, 2019 for SHU suicide 10 prevention training. Did you also not receive 11 that training? 12 MS. NOEL: Yeah. I didn't. 13 MR. : You did not receive that 14 training? 15 MS. NOEL: No. 16 MR. : Did you receive - so 17 there's slides in the back that shows the 18 training and how they conducted it. Did they 19 provide you with those slides? 20 MS. NOEL: No because I wasn't there. 21 MR. : You weren't there? 22 MS. NOEL: I was out on an injury. 23 MR. : Okay. Can you -? When 24 were you out on the injury? What are the 25 dates? EFTA00118250  26 1 MS. NOEL: From March 2019 to - I came 2 back in June. So when I came back in June, 3 that's when I was told to sign this. 4 MR. : Okay. 5 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 6 MR. : Alright. Thank you for 7 signing the Advisory to Union Representative. 8 MS. : I signed it (Indiscernible 9 *00:19:02). 10 MR. : I am just going to sign 11 that form as name of OIG special agent. Again, 12 I do apologize for not providing that up front. 13 MS. : So I just -. 14 MR. : I'm sorry, what was your 15 question? 16 MS. NOEL: I want to call because 17 (Indiscernible *00:19:15) I'm just saying that 18 well I know that the dynamics are that I should 19 interrupt you in the middle of a question. But 20 interrupt her answering a question. So I was 21 asking were you done because I wanted to just 22 step out for just one second. 23 MR. : You want to step out? 24 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 25 MR. : Okay. We don't want to EFTA00118251  27 1 interrupt the interview because we have a lot 2 of questions to get through. 3 MS. : Mm-hmm. 4 MR. : If the attorneys ask 5 that, that's not really But if you would 6 like to -. 7 MS. : So based on the agreement we 8 just signed, right? 9 MR. : Sure. 10 MS. : It acknowledges the right to 11 have me representing her. And part of those 12 rights are the ability to assist in 13 representing her. Right? And so I don't want 14 to dispute and I don't want to hold up the 15 process at all. I just want to say something 16 to her. 17 MR. : Sure. We'll let that - 18 we'll do that this time, but if this continues 19 to happen, I'm going to have to give you a 20 different form that says you can stay here 21 voluntarily if you want, but we're going to ask 22 you not to interrupt the interview. And if you 23 do, then we're going to ask her if she wants to 24 continue with the interview without you. 25 MS. : So but that form says EFTA00118252  28 1 something contrary to what you're saying. 2 MR. : I'm going to give you a 3 different form that says that I'm going to let 4 you interrupt the interview now to talk to her 5 out there. And if you do it again, I'm going 6 to ask that you not be here any longer so that 7 we can continue with the interview. Obviously, 8 her attorneys would stay here. So I just want 9 to make sure that we don't just continue. 10 MS. : I just need clarity then. I 11 need clarity. 12 MR. : Sure. 13 MS. : So the representing of and 14 talking to the employee who I have the right to 15 represent is considered by you an interruption 16 of the interview? 17 MR. : We haven't even gotten 18 into the questions yet. So 19 MS. : Well 20 MR. : -- yes, we need to 21 continue with the interview. But we're now -. 22 I can allow you to do that now. I'm just not 23 going to be able to allow you to continue to 24 stop the interview and leave the room. 25 MS. : I'm just asking for clarity EFTA00118253  29 1 right. So it was kind of -. 2 MR. : Sure. Absolutely. 3 MS. : And I don't mean to be 4 difficult. It kind of was a yes or no. So 5 you're saying to me based on the document that 6 I signed -. 7 MR. : I'm saying that you can 8 assist her. 9 MS. : I didn't get to -. 10 MR. : Sure. Go ahead. 11 MS. : Okay. So you're saying based 12 on the document that I signed, in my right to 13 represent the employee, which is asking to 14 caucus and say something to Ms. Noel is 15 interrupting the interview even though I have 16 the right to do so based on the document I 17 signed? 18 MR. : It's more for her to be 19 able to ask you for a question. 20 MS. : So it's just a yes or no. 21 MR. : Oh, no-no. I'm the one 22 that's leading the interview here. So if she 23 stops and asks you for clarity, absolutely. 24 You stopping to inform her? No. 25 MS. : I never identified to you that EFTA00118254  30 1 I would be informing her of anything. 2 MR. : Okay. But so yes. To 3 answer your question, you can be here to 4 represent here if she's asking you for the 5 information. I don't want you stopping our 6 interview. 7 MS. : Mm-hmm. 8 MR. : And then asking to leave 9 the room. I'm going to allow that this time. 10 After that, I will consider that an 11 interruption of the interview. 12 MS. : Mm-hmm. 13 MR. : And then we'll have to 14 proceed from there. And then there's a 15 different form to provide you. So does that 16 make sense? 17 MS. : No it doesn't. 18 MR. : Okay. So I'm asking you 19 not to interrupt 20 MS. : Wait. It doesn't make sense 21 but I'm not - that was 22 MR. : So I'm asking you not to 23 interrupt the interview. She may defer to you 24 and ask you for questions. 25 MS. : Mm-hmm. EFTA00118255  31 1 MR. : I'm asking you not to 2 interrupt my questions. 3 MS. : Okay. It doesn't make sense 4 to me. What I'm interpreting is my ability to 5 represent is only if the employee asks a 6 question that's what you're saying to me. 7 MR. : Correct. So her 8 attorneys are here. 9 MS. : I got it. I got it. 10 MR. : Her attorneys are here. 11 I'm asking if she has a question for her union 12 representative 13 MS. : Mm-hmm. 14 MR. : -- she may at any time 15 ask you. 16 MS. : I got it. 17 MR. : I'm asking you not to 18 interrupt. 19 MS. : I got it. 20 MR. : These questions are not 21 for you. 22 MS. : Mm-hmm. 23 MR. : They're not directed at 24 you. 25 MS. : Mm-hmm. EFTA00118256  32 1 MR. : They're directed at Mrs. 2 Noel. 3 MS. : I'm not answering questions. 4 I was just trying to -. I'm representing her. 5 But I understand that there has been a 6 determination of how I'm able to represent. 7 And so I'll deal with that in a different 8 venue. You can move forward. 9 MR. : Alright. Let me read 10 this real quick in this paperwork so that we're 11 not going to have any disputes. 12 MS. : We don't have to. You don't 13 have to continue. Right. Because I don't want 14 to interrupt. So you can go on ahead and move 15 forward. 16 MR. : Okay. So it just says 17 that you may not attempt to answer the 18 questions. 19 MS. : Mm-hmm. 20 MR. : Or dictate the employee's 21 actions to question or otherwise take charge of 22 proceedings. 23 MS. : Mm-hmm. 24 MR. : But again, please feel 25 free to go confer with Ms. Noel. EFTA00118257  33 1 MS. : I appreciate it. Thank you. 2 MR. : I am going to pause the 3 recording. It is currently 10:32 a.m. 4 [Whereupon, the above-entitled matter went off 5 the record and went back on the record.] Okay. 6 The recorder is back on. It is 10:38 a.m. 7 Tuesday, June 22, 2021. This is Senior Special 8 Agent We're resuming the 9 interview. Ms. Noel I just remind you that you 10 are under oath and this is a voluntary 11 interview. I'm sorry. What was your question? 12 MS. : You need me to initial 13 (Indiscernible *00:24:24)? 14 MR. : If you don't mind. And 15 again, it's just to show that you know, what we 16 are looking at. 17 MS. : Okay. 18 MR. : Now since we took that 19 break, is there anything else we want to 20 discuss or -? 21 MS. FOY: No, we can move forward. 22 MS. NOEL: No, thank you. 23 MR. : Thank you again very much 24 for your cooperation with this matter. Is 25 there anything else you wanted to -? No? EFTA00118258  34 1 Alright. DO you know where we left off Lyeson? 2 What was the last question that we asked? 3 MR. : It was what we asked for 4 (Indiscernible *00:24:53) about the injuries. 5 MR. : Okay. So you were 6 telling us you said March through June you were 7 injured? 8 MS. NOEL: Yes. 9 MR. : And you were not actually 10 working during that time? 11 MS. NOEL: No. 12 MR. : Do you remember around 13 when in March and when did it end? Was it the 14 beginning of March, end of March, middle? 15 MS. NOEL: Um I'm not sure. I just know 16 it was March. 17 MR. : Sometime in March? 18 MS. NOEL: Yes. 19 MR. : But when you came back, 20 was it around the 26th when they asked you to 21 sign those? 22 MS. NOEL: I came back in June. I don't 23 recall the date exactly. 24 MR. : Okay. 25 MS. NOEL: But I remember the day I came EFTA00118259  35 1 into work and the lieutenant asked me to go see 2 . And she asked me to sign 3 and I said but I wasn't here. I was out on an 4 injury. And she said she's aware but they need 5 me to sign it for program review. 6 MR. : Okay. 7 MS. NOEL: So I signed. 8 MR. : So both trainings when 9 you signed, they didn't actually even provide 10 you anything? 11 MS. NOEL: No. 12 MR. : Verbally? 13 Electronically? Nothing? 14 MS. NOEL: No. 15 MR. : Okay. And that was on 16 the date that was signed that that happened? 17 MS. NOEL: Actually she told me not to 18 date it. I remember when I was signing, she 19 said don't date it. 20 MR. : But you dated it anyway? 21 Did you have a conversation about that? 22 MS. NOEL: No. 23 MR. : After you dated it, she 24 didn't say why did you date it or anything like 25 that? EFTA00118260  36 1 MS. NOEL: No. 2 MR. : Okay. Did you receive 3 that training though in the annual training 4 courses as well? Like the suicide prevention 5 or the - you know how to operate in the SHU 6 during MCC annual? Or the - I think you call 7 it the IF training? Or during the correctional 8 officer training at FLETC? 9 MS. NOEL: Those trainings are like 10 general overall training. It's not 11 specifically speaking about SHU. Like SHU may 12 come up in the conversations, but it's not 13 specific to SHU or how to operate or run the 14 SHU. 15 MR. : Okay. 16 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 17 MR. : Do you know if they were 18 doing this with other employees as well? 19 Having them sign training that they weren't 20 actually conducting? 21 MS. NOEL: I don't know. 22 MR. : Okay. But did you do 23 this per the direction of your supervisor? 24 MS. NOEL: Supervisor. Yes. 25 MR. : So she - did she EFTA00118261  37 1 specifically you must sign this? 2 MS. NOEL: Yes. 3 MR. : Okay. And again, that 4 was 5 MS. NOEL: 6 MR. And you said 7 and I apologize. I don't know if we were 8 interrupted when Where did you say she is 9 currently? 10 MS. NOEL: She is in Jersey I know. I'm 11 trying to -. 12 MR. : At the FCI Fort Dix? 13 MS. NOEL: Yes. 14 MR. : Okay. 15 MR. FOY: Question real quick. 16 MR. : Absolutely. Do you want 17 a more precise answer to when she was out and 18 when she came back? 19 MR. : Uh, so far -. 20 MR. FOY: Because I happen to know -- 21 MR. : Oh sure. If you'd like. 22 MR. FOY: -- the approximate dates. 23 MR. : Sure. You can provide 24 that. 25 MR. FOY: And this is based on my review EFTA00118262  38 1 of discovery and conversations with Ms. Noel. 2 We're looking at about March 15 to June 24-ish. 3 MR. : Okay. 4 MR. FOY: And I note that the execution 5 was on the 26th. But I think there was some 6 time, you know, it's not like the first minute 7 she was there they had her sign the document. 8 MR. : Okay. 9 MS. NOEL: Right. 10 MR. FOY: So those are the estimated 11 times. I could be off by a day or two, but 12 MR. : Perfect. 13 MR. FOY: The 15th of March to June 24th. 14 MR. : And thank you attorney 15 Foy. 16 MR. FOY: No problem. 17 MR. : During your time at the 18 MCC, how often were you assigned to the special 19 housing unit also known as the SHU? 20 MS. NOEL: Mm. 21 MR. : And this is an 22 approximate. I'm not asking you for like exact 23 amount. 24 MS. NOEL: When I came back from the 25 injury, my assignment was the SHU. So from EFTA00118263  39 1 June 20-whatever to August 10th, I worked the 2 SHU. 3 MR. : Okay. And that was your 4 quarterly assignment was in the SHU from - for 5 that whole summer 6 MS. NOEL: Yes. 7 MR. : -- in 2019? 8 MS. NOEL: Yes. 9 MR. : Okay. Thank you. So I 10 know that you said that you didn't - they 11 didn't provide you with the SHU training. Did 12 they provide you with the policies of the SHU? 13 MS. NOEL: No. 14 MR. : So you never received 15 those policies? Would it have been when you 16 received and you said you had to initial and 17 date something electronically? I think you 18 said when you provided -? 19 MS. NOEL: That's the employee code of 20 conduct. 21 MR. : Okay. 22 MS. NOEL: That's the - like the handbook 23 that's online. 24 MR. : Should have they provided 25 you with the polices and post orders in the EFTA00118264  40 1 SHU? 2 MS. NOEL: In the SHU there is post 3 orders. 4 MR. : Oh, okay. So in the SHU 5 there's the post orders. 6 MS. NOEL: Yes. 7 MR. : And were you provided a 8 copy of that to review? 9 MS. NOEL: Yes. 10 MR. : And had you reviewed 11 that? 12 MS. NOEL: Yes. 13 MR. : Okay. And when did you 14 review that? 15 MS. NOEL: When I came back. 16 MR. : So sometime in that June 17 -- 18 MS. NOEL: So in June. 19 MR. : -- or July timeframe? 20 MS. NOEL: Yes. 21 MR. : Okay. So aside from hose 22 post orders, did you receive any other SHU 23 training? 24 MS. NOEL: No. 25 MR. : No. And who was EFTA00118265  41 1 responsible for making sure that you actually 2 did receive SHU training? 3 MS. NOEL: I don't know. 4 MR. : You don't know was that a 5 lieutenant issue -- 6 MS. NOEL: I assumed -. 7 MR. : -- or your first line 8 supervisor? 9 MS. NOEL: I would assume the lieutenant. 10 My supervisor. I don't know. 11 MR. : And when you say the 12 lieutenant, who was the lieutenant in the SHU 13 at the time? 14 MS. NOEL: 15 MR. -: . Do you know his 16 first name? 17 MS. NOEL: 18 MR. : Okay. And would he be 19 responsible for making sure that you were 20 training when you were in the SHU? 21 MS. NOEL: I mean, I'm going to direct 22 that question to her. I don't know. 23 MR. : I don't want you to 24 direct a question to her. 25 MS. NOEL: Okay. EFTA00118266  42 1 MR. : But if you need to like, 2 yeah, that's fine. 3 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. Yeah. 4 MR. : And if you don't know, 5 that's totally acceptable. 6 MS. NOEL: Yeah because I don't know. 7 MR. : Okay. No-no, that's a 8 totally acceptable answer. 9 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 10 MR. : So yeah, if you know - if 11 you don't know something or you do know 12 something, that's great. You don't really want 13 to ask other people for the answers. 14 MS. NOEL: Right. 15 MR. : You know, obviously if 16 you need to confer, and you know with your 17 attorneys or your union representative, 18 absolutely fine. But we just want to try to 19 get away from them answering for you. 20 MS. NOEL: Okay. 21 MR. : Alright. And then from 22 your recollection though, you don't remember 23 receiving SHU training during the annual 24 refresher training? 25 MS. NOEL: No. EFTA00118267  43 1 MR. : No. Okay. Did you 2 receive training on how to conduct rounds? 3 MS. NOEL: Yes. 4 MR. : And when was that? 5 MS. NOEL: In IF. 6 MR. : In IF? 7 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 8 MR. : Okay. And what did it 9 teach you about conducting rounds? 10 MS. NOEL: That you need two people to 11 count and conduct rounds. And one person goes 12 and counts. The other person goes and counts. 13 And then you confirm the numbers of counting. 14 MR. : Okay. 15 MS. NOEL: And make sure when you're 16 counting that you're counting everybody's 17 standing at their bed when you're counting. 18 MR. : Okay. And did you 19 receive suicide prevention training during the 20 MCC annual refresher training? 21 MS. NOEL: I don't recall. 22 MR. : You don't recall. 23 MS. NOEL: Mm-hmm. 24 MR. : Okay. What was your 25 understanding if an inmate was placed, you EFTA00118268  44 1 know, is suicidal or placed on suicide watch? 2 What was your understanding of how you should 3 treat those inmates? 4 MS. NOEL: If an inmate is placed on 5 suicide watch, I don't deal with them. They go 6 downstairs to suicide watch and they're being 7 watched by other inmates. 8 MR. : Mm-hmm. 9 MS. NOEL: But and then when they're 10 cleared, they come back to the unit. 11 MR. : And are you trained - are 12 you