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[00:00:00] Without further ado, Brendan Carr, [00:00:01] chairman of the FCC joins us now. Uh [00:00:05] Brendan, this is a a I think if or the [00:00:08] average person watching at home, this [00:00:09] has been a very confusing story that [00:00:11] they've seen play out. Seems like James [00:00:13] Tel Rico is getting the benefit of it. [00:00:15] He's raising all this money off of it. [00:00:17] So, here's the allegation I want you to [00:00:19] confirm or deny its veracity. The FCC [00:00:23] strongarmed CBS said you cannot have [00:00:26] James Tal Rico on the air at Col Bear or [00:00:29] else. [00:00:31] >> The way they summarized it, they [00:00:32] basically just like they pulled the gun [00:00:33] and they're like, "You can't have them [00:00:34] on." [00:00:34] >> Exactly. You You guys You guys are the [00:00:36] mean bullies saying Co Bear can't have [00:00:38] James Tico on the air. What is true and [00:00:41] what is fiction? [00:00:43] >> Well, look, as soon as I found out that [00:00:44] Telerico is beyond, I went down to the [00:00:46] bowels of the FCC, the media bureau. I [00:00:49] found the dump button. I pushed it and I [00:00:50] said, "These are MAGA airwaves now. You [00:00:52] can't run that [laughter] on here." Um, [00:00:55] no, the reality is I woke up Tuesday [00:00:57] morning and I saw on social media that [00:00:59] the FCC had allegedly refused to air an [00:01:03] interview and this has been just so [00:01:05] amazing to watch in terms of why [00:01:08] everyday Americans have lost so much [00:01:10] trust in the legitimacy of the legacy [00:01:13] media. So, the claim was made by a [00:01:15] politician that the FC refused to air an [00:01:18] interview, which simply did not happen. [00:01:20] And then the claim was, well, it was CBS [00:01:22] that refused to air the interview. And [00:01:24] then CBS came out and said, "No, again, [00:01:26] that didn't happen. All we said was we [00:01:28] provided guidance, CBS claims, uh, to [00:01:31] how they could do the interview on [00:01:32] broadcast TV and comply with all [00:01:34] appropriate regulations." But instead, [00:01:36] you saw Cobar and Telerico do that meme [00:01:38] where you take a stick and poke it in [00:01:40] your own front spokes of your bicycle [00:01:42] fall down and claim that they have been [00:01:44] the victims. And the reason this worked [00:01:45] is because they knew that the [00:01:47] predisposition of the legacy media would [00:01:50] be that they would eat this up. And they [00:01:52] did. They eat it up like slop. Uh, and [00:01:54] it ended up boomeranging on them. The [00:01:56] real issue here is this is demand ondem [00:01:58] violence. This is one politician in a [00:02:00] Dem primary trying to get a leg up and [00:02:02] clicks up and donations up as compared [00:02:04] to another Democrat. So, this is demand [00:02:07] violence that they're just trying to [00:02:08] merchandise as having something to do [00:02:09] with Trump or the FCC. And again, it had [00:02:12] zero to do with us. I learned about this [00:02:14] completely totally after the fact. [00:02:16] That's amazing. You found out about it [00:02:17] on Twitter like so many people. So, [00:02:20] okay, this is the way I understand it. [00:02:22] And again, confirm or deny. This only [00:02:24] applies to at this point at this point [00:02:26] in the calendar cuz we're in primary [00:02:27] season Dem versus Dem. So if the the [00:02:30] equal time rule is basically that [00:02:34] James Tal Rico goes on, well then [00:02:36] Colbear has to at least extend an [00:02:38] invitation to uh uh what's her name? [00:02:42] Jasmine Crockett and that's all that [00:02:44] this says. So you just at least have to [00:02:46] invite her on equal time. Is that [00:02:48] essentially right? You're not you're not [00:02:49] alleging the FCC is not telling CBS and [00:02:52] CBS is not telling Coar that they need [00:02:54] to go have uh John Cornin and Paxton on [00:02:58] as equal time. It's just re relevant to [00:03:00] the the Democrat primary. [00:03:03] That's essentially right. So if you step [00:03:04] back, broadcast TV, broadcast radio is [00:03:07] fundamentally different than any other [00:03:09] form of distribution of program. It's [00:03:11] different than uh online. It's different [00:03:13] than YouTube. It's different than cable. [00:03:15] If you have a broadcast license, there's [00:03:17] special unique things you have to do [00:03:18] because you got the license for free. [00:03:20] It's a valuable public resource and the [00:03:22] government is excluding other people. [00:03:24] So, they're excluding other people, [00:03:26] which means it's a public trustee model. [00:03:28] You need to look out for the interests [00:03:29] of everybody. Okay, that's the baseline. [00:03:31] Then there was a particular rule, a [00:03:33] statute actually, that Congress passed [00:03:35] that said if you're going to have a [00:03:36] legally qualified candidate on the air, [00:03:38] you have to, to your point, extend an [00:03:40] offer to all other legally qualified [00:03:42] candidates. Doesn't need to be the same [00:03:43] program. doesn't need to be the same [00:03:45] host. If for some reason Coar doesn't [00:03:46] want to have uh Crockett on, he doesn't [00:03:49] have to do that. It's just at some point [00:03:51] they've got to offer a comparable time. [00:03:52] That's the baseline. Now, there's an [00:03:54] exception to that rule. And the [00:03:56] exception is if you are what's defined [00:03:57] in the statute as a bonafide news [00:04:00] program. If you are a bonafide news [00:04:02] program, meaning I guess not fake news, [00:04:04] then you don't need to comply with equal [00:04:07] time. And the idea there was Congress [00:04:08] was thinking about, you know, Meet the [00:04:10] Press and other sort of hard-hitting [00:04:12] journalistic shows where the hosts [00:04:14] weren't trying to put a thumb on the [00:04:15] scale for one particular candidate or [00:04:17] one particular party. And over the [00:04:19] years, the FCC issued decisions that [00:04:21] people read as effectively having the [00:04:23] exception swallow the rule, meaning [00:04:25] anything that goes on on broadcast TV, [00:04:26] whether it's daytime, nighttime, is [00:04:28] itself bonafideed news and doesn't have [00:04:30] to comply. And what we've told people is [00:04:32] no, that's not the law. Follow the law. [00:04:35] If you haven't established your bonafide [00:04:36] news, give people equal time. But to [00:04:38] your point, Coar did not have to have [00:04:40] anyone else on that program. He could [00:04:41] have run it and all you have to do is [00:04:43] put a file, a filing in your public [00:04:45] file, which broadcasters have, that [00:04:47] said, we allowed airtime for this [00:04:48] candidate. If there's another candidate [00:04:50] out there, come talk to us and let's see [00:04:52] if we can work something out. That's all [00:04:53] they would have been required to do. As [00:04:54] America turns [music] 250 this year, we [00:04:57] want to help good ranchers take a moment [00:04:59] to remember the people who helped build [00:05:00] it. Not the ones in the history books, [00:05:02] but the ones who woke up before the sun, [00:05:04] season after season, without seeking any [00:05:06] sort of applause. And those people are [00:05:08] America's ranchers. [music] For over 250 [00:05:10] years, ranchers have worked tirelessly [00:05:12] to feed America through every kind of [00:05:14] storm, through droughts, wars, [music] [00:05:15] recessions, pandemics. That's the kind [00:05:18] of legacy Good Ranchers was built on. [00:05:20] Unlike others, Good Ranchers is a meat [00:05:22] company that's 100% [music] [00:05:24] committed to America. And if you [00:05:25] subscribe to any of their boxes of 100% [00:05:28] American meat, you'll save up to $500 a [00:05:31] year. Plus, if you use our code Kirk [00:05:33] Kirk, you'll get an additional $25 off [00:05:36] your first order. Visit goodranchers.com [00:05:38] today. [00:05:40] >> Oh, well, they are turning it into like [00:05:43] World War II over here that you guys are [00:05:45] the biggest, baddest bullies. So, let's [00:05:47] go ahead. This is what's funny to me, [00:05:49] too, is that you've got, you know, Mr. [00:05:51] Potato Man, Brian Stelter chiming in. [00:05:54] You've got Jen Saki and they're all [00:05:56] they're all paritting this hoax. It's [00:05:59] amazing. 507. This is Brian Stelter. [00:06:02] >> Put Talico's tweet on screen. He said [00:06:04] the FCC banned our Co Bear interview. [00:06:06] And and he's wrong about that. The FCC [00:06:08] did not ban the interview. And that's [00:06:09] what is actually so interesting about [00:06:11] this. It's about the impression, the [00:06:14] possibility of interference causing the [00:06:17] networks to possibly self censor. [00:06:19] And you got Cole Bear, [00:06:22] big hissy fit. 508. [00:06:25] >> You know who is not one of my guests [00:06:27] tonight? That's Texas State [00:06:29] Representative James Talerico. [00:06:31] He He was supposed to be here, but we [00:06:34] were told in no uncertain terms by our [00:06:36] network's lawyers who called us directly [00:06:38] that we could not have him on the [00:06:40] broadcast. [00:06:43] And it looks like Trico to your point uh [00:06:48] Mr. chairman that uh he's he's taken [00:06:50] advantage of this 5:15 [00:06:55] >> FCC opening probe into the view after [00:06:57] appearance by Telerico. Do you mean to [00:07:00] cause trouble? [00:07:01] >> I I I [00:07:04] think that Donald Trump is worried that [00:07:06] we're about to flip Texas. [00:07:09] [cheering] [00:07:14] >> So, he's raised millions off that. What [00:07:16] you just saw was actually they posted it [00:07:17] to YouTube instead. I guess like six [00:07:19] million people have tuned in. I mean [00:07:20] that he it's boomeranged very well for [00:07:22] Tar Rico. But you said this is Dem on [00:07:25] Dem violence Brendan. And the one person [00:07:27] that's really upset is Jasmine Crockett. [00:07:29] [laughter] [00:07:30] >> BAGA operative. [00:07:31] >> Yeah. Vag Vaga operative. She's actually [00:07:33] the one calling, you know, BS on all [00:07:36] this. Um again, so what is that that [00:07:39] part that they said the FCC probe into [00:07:41] the view? Can you explain what what that [00:07:42] that was about that allegation? [00:07:45] >> There's a separate episode where The [00:07:47] View, which is owned by Disney, uh did [00:07:49] have Taler Rico on on the broadcast [00:07:51] airwaves and Disney has not established [00:07:53] that that program is a bonafide news [00:07:57] programs. We've begun an enforcement [00:07:59] proceeding, enforcement actions into the [00:08:02] view. uh because if they are not [00:08:04] bonafideed news and again we don't think [00:08:06] they've established that at this point [00:08:07] then they would needed to have offered [00:08:09] and frankly they could still offer equal [00:08:11] opportunity to the other candidates [00:08:13] including Jasmine Crockett but this was [00:08:16] you know look this was a I don't think [00:08:17] it was a sophisticated play because you [00:08:19] just have to understand uh the biases of [00:08:21] the fake news media in order to run this [00:08:24] but you know Terico effectively self [00:08:26] striand affected this one so you know [00:08:28] hats off to him but yeah if I was [00:08:30] Crockett I'd be mad if Crockett came out [00:08:32] the day that this happened and said this [00:08:33] wasn't FCC censorship. This was Coair [00:08:36] and Telerico deciding not to have her on [00:08:38] the program for reasons that you know [00:08:40] you'll have to ask them. [00:08:41] >> And this is the key. This is essentially [00:08:44] why the rule is important, Brendan. This [00:08:46] equal time because what you have [00:08:48] instead, you don't have the voice of the [00:08:49] people. You have elites at these [00:08:51] networks [00:08:52] >> that have basically put their thumb on [00:08:54] the scale and said, "We want Tal Rico. [00:08:56] We think he can beat whether it's Cornin [00:08:59] or Paxton. We think he's the guy to beat [00:09:01] them and we're going to prop this guy [00:09:03] up. They're very good at these [00:09:03] operations. [00:09:04] >> This is an elite gatekeeping in the old [00:09:06] school model. [00:09:08] >> That's the whole point of the rule was [00:09:09] that Congress came in and said, "We [00:09:10] don't want media elites, media [00:09:12] gatekeepers deciding the outcomes of [00:09:14] primary or elections. We want the people [00:09:16] to do it. We want the people of Texas to [00:09:19] make their mind up without unlawful [00:09:20] interference from media gatekeepers." [00:09:22] The whole reason that the rule was in [00:09:24] place. [00:09:24] >> Now, big picture, I I think that is [00:09:26] worth asking. You say that is Congress's [00:09:28] intent, but this does date to when there [00:09:30] were two, three network television [00:09:33] outlets, some radio outlets, and that's [00:09:35] what media was. Today, we have shows [00:09:37] like this one. We have infinite [00:09:39] podcasts, everything on social media. Do [00:09:42] you think there's a case to be made this [00:09:43] is sort of an obsolete standard that it [00:09:46] infringes a little bit on freedom of [00:09:48] speech and there's so many ways to get [00:09:50] your message out there now? What do you [00:09:52] make of that? Overall, [00:09:54] >> there's a lot of reasonable people that [00:09:55] say there's such a diversity of [00:09:57] mechanisms to get your perspectives out [00:09:59] there that we don't need those types of [00:10:01] regulations. I guess I would say two [00:10:02] things. one, it almost cuts the other [00:10:05] way because there's so many ways that [00:10:06] you can get the message out, YouTube, [00:10:08] podcast, streaming, social media, that [00:10:11] if you want to use that one medium that [00:10:14] has just a unique set of rules that you [00:10:16] should do it because it isn't really a [00:10:17] constraint on you because you can go [00:10:18] somewhere else if you don't want to [00:10:19] abide by the broadcast regulations. I [00:10:22] guess the second point I'd make is that [00:10:23] if people want to do that, then they can [00:10:25] go to Congress and they can change the [00:10:26] law. But, you know, my job at this point [00:10:28] is to uh enforce in a fair and balanced [00:10:31] way the laws passed by Congress, and [00:10:33] that's that's what we're going to be [00:10:34] doing. [00:10:35] >> Brendan, thank you for separating fact [00:10:38] from fiction in this co I call it the Co [00:10:40] Bear hoax cuz it's a complete I mean, [00:10:42] it's been a ratings boom for him. And [00:10:44] and by the way, his YouTube is uh 6 [00:10:46] million views or something is what I [00:10:47] what I saw. I didn't watch it, but [00:10:49] anyways, Brennan Carr, chairman of the [00:10:51] FCC, thank you for making the time and [00:10:52] helping us out understand the the the [00:10:54] Colair hoax. I'm sure there'll be plenty [00:10:56] more in the future. [00:10:58] >> Yeah, good to see you guys. Thanks.