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[00:00:00] Hello everyone and welcome to Mintcast, [00:00:02] the official podcast of Mintress News. I [00:00:05] am your host, Manara Adli, and I'm the [00:00:07] founder and director of Mint Press News. [00:00:11] It seems that the United States is ready [00:00:13] for yet another war, another [00:00:15] confrontation. It's trying to start a [00:00:18] war now with Venezuela. The Trump [00:00:20] administration has sent a fleet of [00:00:23] warships alongside thousands of soldiers [00:00:26] to the Caribbean, even blowing up a [00:00:28] Venezuelan ship it claimed was involved [00:00:31] in the drug trade. But Washington has [00:00:34] had its eyes on regime change in [00:00:36] Venezuela for decades, sponsoring coups, [00:00:39] opposition movements, and military [00:00:41] operations against the socialist [00:00:43] government. So, how close are we to yet [00:00:46] another forever war? It's almost like we [00:00:49] can't keep up from the current war that [00:00:51] the United States is backing with Israel [00:00:53] and its genocide and its occupation [00:00:58] and its agitation of other countries [00:01:00] including the latest bombing in Qatar, [00:01:03] Lebanon, Tunisia with the Samud [00:01:06] flatillas. It is just ongoing and it [00:01:09] feels like we can't keep up. Um, but we [00:01:11] will be dismantling some of the [00:01:13] propaganda when it comes to this crisis, [00:01:17] uh, this buildup for an invasion of [00:01:20] Venezuela. I am joined by three people [00:01:23] today to discuss this issue. Joining [00:01:25] from Karacas is Diego Seuera. He is a [00:01:29] journalist, a writer and local and with [00:01:32] the local media outlet Mission Verdad. [00:01:35] Also joining me is Leonardo Flores. He [00:01:38] is the co-founder of the Venezuela [00:01:40] Solidarity Network and a former analyst [00:01:42] with the Venezuelan Embassy in [00:01:45] Washington DC. And finally, we have the [00:01:48] brilliant Alan Mloud who's also here. He [00:01:51] is our senior staff writer and lead [00:01:54] investigative journalist at Mitress [00:01:56] News. and you know he has completed his [00:01:59] PhD on the topic of Venezuelan politics [00:02:02] and wrote the book bad news from [00:02:05] Venezuela 20 years of fake news and [00:02:07] misreporting. Make sure to order his [00:02:09] book and check that out. I feel so [00:02:11] humbled to be here with all of you uh [00:02:14] gentlemen. Um you guys are definitely [00:02:16] this is like the all-star team to talk [00:02:18] about what's happening in Venezuela and [00:02:21] of course I wish it was under better [00:02:22] circumstances. Thank you gentlemen for [00:02:24] joining me today. [00:02:27] Thank you. [00:02:28] >> Thank you. It's a pleasure to be on Mint [00:02:29] Press and I hope uh viewers continue to [00:02:31] support the great journalism that you [00:02:33] you all are doing. [00:02:35] >> Really appreciate that. And before we [00:02:38] get on into the show, I do have a [00:02:40] special announcement to make. If you've [00:02:42] been following Mitress News, you might [00:02:44] have noticed that we launched a recent [00:02:46] campaign on Indiegogo. Mitress News is [00:02:49] facing an exist existential threat. [00:02:52] After 14 years of providing fearless [00:02:55] independent investigative journalism [00:02:57] that holds the militaryindustrial [00:02:59] complex accountable, we are actually now [00:03:02] at risk of shutting down. Um, one of our [00:03:04] main lines of funding has been cut and [00:03:07] so we need every single person who's [00:03:09] watching us today to go on Indiegogo and [00:03:12] support our campaign. You know, if [00:03:15] you've been following us for the 14 [00:03:17] years or even just from the couple of [00:03:18] years, you might already know that we [00:03:19] were banned from PayPal. Algorithmically [00:03:22] blacklisted from Google um from their [00:03:26] project Owl. We've been algorithmically [00:03:29] shadowbanned on Twitter, Facebook, and [00:03:31] Tik Tok. We were banned actually from [00:03:32] Tik Tok. And it's all because of our [00:03:34] reporting that names the names the [00:03:37] names. And so we are asking you, our [00:03:40] viewers and readers, the lifeblood of [00:03:42] our independent organization, to support [00:03:45] Mit Press News as we continue to [00:03:47] challenge and scrutinize empire, [00:03:50] imperialism, and the militaryindustrial [00:03:53] complex. It is because of independent [00:03:55] journalism that people are becoming more [00:03:58] aware in the United States about the [00:04:01] United States addiction to war. So, your [00:04:04] support means everything to us to help [00:04:07] us keep on going. Join us on Indiegogo. [00:04:11] So, let's um turn back to what we uh [00:04:15] were planning on talking to, which is [00:04:17] Venezuela right now. It's completely [00:04:20] disturbing what the United States is [00:04:22] doing, having its warships encircling [00:04:25] the country. The Trump administration [00:04:27] has placed a $50 million bounty on [00:04:30] President Maduro's head. So Diego, I [00:04:33] want to start with you. As someone who [00:04:35] is who is Venezuelan, who is there as a [00:04:37] journalist, what is the sentiment right [00:04:40] now inside of Venezuela with the United [00:04:42] States having its warheads pointed [00:04:44] directly at your country? What is the [00:04:46] situation on the ground right now? [00:04:49] >> Thank you, Manara. It's a pleasure to be [00:04:52] here and of course you know you're well [00:04:55] aware. You got my full support given the [00:04:57] new challenges, a new round of [00:04:59] challenges for you. I'm sure you're [00:05:01] going to overcome [00:05:03] regarding the situation in here. Well, [00:05:05] you know, Venezuela has has gone through [00:05:08] so much that the first noise I guess [00:05:11] it's not so paralyzing or shocking. [00:05:14] People are about their own business. I'm [00:05:16] in a very bustling area of Karakas which [00:05:20] it could be a good benchmark to measure [00:05:22] what how Karakas at least it's it's [00:05:24] behaving these days and it's it kind of [00:05:28] gives the impression that basically [00:05:29] nothing is happening or will happen but [00:05:31] of course this has to do with like I [00:05:34] said it has a lot to do with this is not [00:05:37] the first time not even the first time [00:05:39] of of threats of military action and um [00:05:44] and besides the point. I mean, until [00:05:47] something really happens, I think we're [00:05:48] going to we're not going to see the [00:05:50] actual reaction of people. But beyond [00:05:52] that point, I mean, during on the on a [00:05:54] more media and political level, you can [00:05:56] see also that uh our president has [00:05:59] called for enlisting in the national [00:06:02] militia uh which is a component of the [00:06:05] of our armed forces [00:06:08] couple of weeks ago and [00:06:10] a lot of people basically joined who [00:06:12] signed up. huge numbers they said and [00:06:16] they talk about even eight million uh [00:06:20] make that whatever you want you want [00:06:22] about it I'm sure that it's a lot of [00:06:23] people anyways and um and you know this [00:06:27] also goes beyond the sphere of charisma [00:06:30] itself [00:06:32] there are I don't know how aware [00:06:35] the US is probably not I mean usually [00:06:37] this is also usually based on fraud [00:06:39] analysis that set ups a strategy and um [00:06:43] and usually bring brings a lot of blocks [00:06:45] with with them that also at some point [00:06:48] becomes blowback. [00:06:50] I don't know how sure they are, how [00:06:52] aware they are of the let's call it the [00:06:54] nationalist vein, the body vein that not [00:06:56] necessarily means that a Venezuelan [00:06:58] citizen necessarily supports the [00:07:01] government support charisma [00:07:03] but when and even [00:07:07] looking for change for political change [00:07:09] but one thing is to have those ideas and [00:07:11] another one is to [00:07:13] be threatened directly by the US for [00:07:16] regime change in this case because of [00:07:17] course you can clearly see through the [00:07:21] accusations of the cartel de or whether [00:07:23] we can talk about that further on but um [00:07:27] you can't stop this and think that [00:07:31] people beyond that freight is not going [00:07:32] to react or oppose there already even [00:07:34] opposition politicians that already said [00:07:37] that in any given situation of this sort [00:07:40] a hypothetical attack our president it's [00:07:44] Nicolas Maluro and this is our country [00:07:45] we're going to defend it of course [00:07:47] there's also a French spectrum here of [00:07:50] people who are [00:07:52] some you can say wishful think wishfully [00:07:56] thinking and then you have from the [00:07:57] extremist factions of the opposition you [00:07:59] have people who are actually craving for [00:08:00] this because this would do their work [00:08:02] you know as in finding what they call an [00:08:05] easiest direct way of breaking change [00:08:06] which is not that's part of this flaw [00:08:09] analysis we've been talking about so [00:08:13] right now I mean like I said you don't [00:08:16] get the feel properly unless you check [00:08:18] out the news unless you are following [00:08:20] what the the recent statement and where [00:08:23] the footage we've seen from southern [00:08:24] Puerto Rico or or the yeah what the [00:08:28] president the vice president Marco Rubio [00:08:30] everyone has been saying about [00:08:31] Venezuela. [00:08:33] So [00:08:35] one has to be of course has to be [00:08:37] cautious and we don't expect the best of [00:08:39] the situation right now but there's no [00:08:41] fear on the street which is like the [00:08:42] main headline I would I would choose to [00:08:45] sum up the situation here right now [00:08:48] >> we're talking about a country who is led [00:08:52] by a revolutionary vision by Hugo Chavez [00:08:55] a workers revolution and he famously [00:08:58] called the United States the great Satan [00:09:01] and for good reason. I mean, Venezuela [00:09:03] has been the target of US imperialist um [00:09:07] sabotage against this country for [00:09:09] decades and including coups. And when I [00:09:13] visited Venezuela [00:09:15] a few years ago, Diego, you were one of [00:09:17] the people that hosted me there. I mean, [00:09:20] I was I was there as an independent um [00:09:23] election observer and I met with people [00:09:26] and I walked through the streets and it [00:09:29] was just so beautiful to see just how [00:09:30] much support people had for the [00:09:33] revolution that Nicholas Maduro was [00:09:35] carrying on. And it was obvious that [00:09:39] Venezuela is a country that res [00:09:42] represents resistance to US imperialism. [00:09:44] And it does not surprise me that every [00:09:47] single attempt the US has made to [00:09:49] overthrow the government in Venezuela [00:09:51] has failed. They've failed. Every single [00:09:53] one of them because the people there, [00:09:55] the majority of the people stand with [00:09:57] the revolution and they stand with Hugo [00:10:00] Chavez and they stand with Nicolos [00:10:01] Maduro. So it would not surprise me that [00:10:04] 8 million people joined uh this force to [00:10:08] defend their country from US sabotage. [00:10:12] And so, Leonardo, um, you know, I think [00:10:15] it's really important that we break down [00:10:17] and dismantle the these, uh, neo narot [00:10:22] trafficking, uh, accusations that are [00:10:25] being [00:10:26] put on Nicolas Maduro himself. So, what [00:10:28] do you make of these allegations about [00:10:30] Maduro and about Venezuela being a drug [00:10:34] producing hot spot? [00:10:37] >> Yeah, I mean, all the evidence runs [00:10:38] counter to that to that claim, right? [00:10:40] that Venezuela somehow is a drug [00:10:42] producing hot spot. In fact, when we [00:10:44] look at the numbers, and these are [00:10:45] numbers that the DEA agrees with, it's [00:10:47] that Venezuela produces zero cocaine. It [00:10:50] does not grow cocoa leaf. It does not at [00:10:52] the at most at most 5% of the cocaine [00:10:56] produced in South America flows out of [00:10:59] Venezuela as a transit country. So, the [00:11:02] the bulk of the cocaine rather than [00:11:04] flowing out of the Caribbean flows [00:11:06] through the Pacific. We're talking 87%. [00:11:08] 70% and this is a figure that just came [00:11:11] out pretty recently that they estimate [00:11:13] that 70% of the cocaine in the world [00:11:15] flows actually out of Ecuador which has [00:11:17] a Pacific coastline. So this idea that [00:11:19] somehow the United States is sending its [00:11:21] warships to the Caribbean to the [00:11:23] Venezuelan coast or right outside on [00:11:25] international waters to protect American [00:11:28] citizens from drugs. It's ludicrous [00:11:30] because if you wanted to do that first [00:11:32] of all you wouldn't use the military for [00:11:33] that. You know, we know from 50 years [00:11:36] almost of the war on drugs that a war [00:11:38] that has completely failed that [00:11:40] militarizing this war or militarizing [00:11:42] this problem rather is not a solution. [00:11:45] Secondly, [00:11:46] cocaine is hardly the big problem in the [00:11:49] United States right now when we're [00:11:50] talking about drug use and overdoses and [00:11:52] when we see people on the streets of our [00:11:54] cities that are suffering from [00:11:55] addiction. It's opioids, it's fentinyl, [00:11:57] it's heroin, it's other things that not [00:12:00] cocaine, right? Cocaine was a big [00:12:02] problem back in the 80s, early 90s. Now, [00:12:04] not as much. It's it's other drugs that [00:12:06] Venezuela doesn't produce at all. [00:12:08] Fentinel, there's no fentinel in [00:12:09] Venezuela that goes to the United [00:12:10] States. So, so, so this is a myth that [00:12:13] really we have to take down and we have [00:12:15] to debunk, right? And then when we talk [00:12:18] about these narco terrorism charges, I [00:12:20] mean, this is absurd, right? I mean, I [00:12:23] challenge anyone to name one terrorist [00:12:25] act that the Bolivarian government has [00:12:27] carried out in the past 26 27 years [00:12:29] since it was first elected. There's [00:12:31] there's none. The drug charges [00:12:34] themselves, you know, they they focus on [00:12:36] the trenda. They focus on the cartel [00:12:38] dees, but then their own reports really [00:12:41] undercut their arguments. When I say [00:12:43] their own reports, I'm talking about uh [00:12:45] the United States intelligence services [00:12:47] and and other agencies. So, for example, [00:12:50] there was this memo that was uh leaked [00:12:52] in I think believe it was May from the [00:12:54] National Intelligence Council. And here [00:12:56] I'm going to read a quote where it says, [00:12:58] "The Maduro regime probably does not [00:13:00] have a policy of cooperating with TDA, [00:13:03] TDA's Trenarawa, and is not directing [00:13:05] TDA movements and operations in the [00:13:08] United States. [00:13:10] Venezuelan intelligence, military, and [00:13:12] police services view TDA as a security [00:13:14] threat and operate against it in ways [00:13:17] that make it highly unlikely the two [00:13:19] sides would cooperate in a strategic or [00:13:21] consistent way. So, right away, this is [00:13:24] the top levels of US intelligence, [00:13:26] acknowledging that TDA not only doesn't [00:13:29] work with Venezuela, but that Venezuela [00:13:30] views it as a threat. And in fact, the [00:13:33] TDA was functionally destroyed by the [00:13:35] Venezuelan security forces in 2022, [00:13:38] 2023. And now what we have are remnants [00:13:40] of the TVA throughout the hemisphere [00:13:42] that kind of act as a loose network or [00:13:44] that trade on this TDA name to kind of [00:13:47] further their criminal enterprises. On [00:13:49] top of that, let me just read a quick [00:13:51] quote from the DEA's National Drug [00:13:53] Threat Assessment. This is a a yearly [00:13:56] report that the DEA issues. And in the [00:13:58] 2025 report, they say TDA members also [00:14:01] conduct smallcale drug trafficking [00:14:04] activities. So in this drug DEA report, [00:14:08] the only mentions of Venezuela are in [00:14:10] this two these two paragraphs about TDA [00:14:12] where they don't even say that it's a [00:14:14] cartel and they don't go into narotism. [00:14:17] They say mostly that the TDA uses [00:14:19] engages in human trafficking and [00:14:20] smuggling and and and really uh using [00:14:24] migrants to their own ends and does very [00:14:27] little drug trafficking [00:14:29] that the so it undercuts the Trump [00:14:31] administration's argument about [00:14:32] naroterrorism completely. Furthermore, [00:14:35] and I'll just add in terms of Cartelro [00:14:37] Sodes, you know, I was looking back [00:14:39] through these drug assessment reports [00:14:40] for the past 15 years, some of them [00:14:43] aren't publicly available, but in the [00:14:45] ones that were, and I looked at around a [00:14:46] dozen or so, the Cartendos, do you know [00:14:49] how many times it's mentioned? Zero [00:14:51] times. Zero mentions at all over the [00:14:54] past 15 years. So clearly, this is not a [00:14:57] cartel that first of all, it's a cartel [00:14:59] that doesn't exist. Secondly, it's not [00:15:01] any sort of threat to the United States. [00:15:03] So what we're seeing is kind of the [00:15:05] political maneuvering by Marco Rubio and [00:15:08] other hardliners that really are more [00:15:10] interested in Cuba than Venezuela using [00:15:14] this kind of rhetoric of crime and [00:15:16] narotism to push the United States into [00:15:19] a conflict with Venezuela. [00:15:21] >> Absolutely. And I think if the United [00:15:23] States cared about the war on drugs, we [00:15:25] wouldn't have had our US military [00:15:28] members, our soldiers, [00:15:31] you know, defending those uh poppy [00:15:33] plants in Afghanistan. Um, and I I want [00:15:37] to point out that Marco Rubio's [00:15:39] pronouncements about being tough on [00:15:41] drugs, you know, they really fall flat [00:15:43] when we remember his own brother-in-law, [00:15:46] Orlando Cecilia, was a cocaine drug lord [00:15:49] who spent over 12 years in a Florida [00:15:52] prison. So, you know, it's it's obvious [00:15:56] that Washington has always wanted to [00:15:58] gain back control over Venezuela's uh [00:16:01] oil and Venezuela's incredible uh [00:16:04] mineral wealth. Of course, we know that [00:16:07] this includes the largest proven oil [00:16:09] reserves in the world, but also [00:16:10] significant deposits of iron, natural [00:16:12] gas, gold, and diamonds, and other [00:16:16] minerals that are used for the uh for [00:16:18] military equipment. [00:16:20] And so Allan um you know there is [00:16:23] obviously a huge undertone to all this [00:16:26] which is that the US with that the US's [00:16:28] history of trying to provoke regime [00:16:31] change in Venezuela. Could you first [00:16:34] tell us what Marco Rubio has said about [00:16:38] Venezuela and then kind of give us a [00:16:40] history of the United States provoking [00:16:43] regime change? [00:16:46] >> Yeah, sure. So Marco Rubio is a [00:16:48] CubanAmerican Secretary of State and he [00:16:52] has really been a hardliner on Venezuela [00:16:54] for his entire career like so many Cuban [00:16:57] Americans uh have. Um we know what uh [00:17:01] Rubio was doing in the first Trump [00:17:03] administration from books like uh Mark [00:17:06] Esper's tell all book that came out. [00:17:08] Mark Esper was the defense secretary [00:17:09] under Trump. You can also read National [00:17:12] Security Adviser, John Bolton's book, [00:17:14] The Room Where It Happens. And basically [00:17:17] what came out of that it was that Rubio [00:17:19] was one of the super hawks uh in the [00:17:22] cabinet really pushing for regime change [00:17:24] even pushing for a potential military [00:17:27] invasion of Venezuela. Uh we might [00:17:29] remember in 2020 the uh United States [00:17:34] tried to launch a series of coups um [00:17:36] trying to push Juan Guyaido into the uh [00:17:39] Mira Flores presidential palace. During [00:17:42] that time, Rubio was really one of the [00:17:44] strongest supporters of that and he was [00:17:46] probably the brains behind it. You might [00:17:48] even remember him tweeting pictures of [00:17:51] um uh Gaddafi being uh lynched and uh [00:17:54] sodomized to Nicholas Maduro at the [00:17:57] time. So he was putting that out in a [00:17:59] public forum, you know, snuff pictures [00:18:01] basically uh trying to intimidate uh a [00:18:04] government and a foreign official in [00:18:07] that way. So Rubio, yeah, he's, you [00:18:10] know, one of these uh the real [00:18:11] hardliners. I did call him a mastermind, [00:18:14] but you know, frankly, it's it's clear [00:18:16] that he doesn't really understand a lot [00:18:18] about Venezuela. There was one time when [00:18:20] I remember he was on uh social media [00:18:23] talking about how uh the socialist [00:18:25] government is um is falling and and a [00:18:28] reason for this is because the uh the [00:18:30] Kerman Dam in Venezuela had been uh [00:18:33] destroyed. but he'd completely [00:18:35] misunderstood uh the article and [00:18:37] actually the uh the journalist who wrote [00:18:40] it came in and said actually that's not [00:18:42] at all what happened. My name is Kamand [00:18:44] you've completely misunderstood what's [00:18:46] going on here and yeah I mean he's he's [00:18:48] a ridiculous figure in so many ways. Um [00:18:51] but he is pretty typical for uh the US [00:18:54] whether it's Democrat or Republican in [00:18:56] the administration. [00:18:59] Before 1998 and the election of uh Hugo [00:19:02] Chavez, Venezuela is actually one of the [00:19:04] US's key allies in the region and it was [00:19:07] doing whatever it was told. Basically, [00:19:09] it would pump oil whenever the United [00:19:11] States told it to to keep the prices [00:19:13] nice and low. But all of that changed [00:19:15] when Chavez was elected. And uh pretty [00:19:18] quickly he realized that the minerals [00:19:21] wealth of Venezuela really had to be [00:19:23] directed towards uh benefiting the [00:19:26] people of Venezuela. And that put him [00:19:28] right in the crosshairs of the United [00:19:30] States. And so really I have to say for [00:19:32] the last quarter of a century there [00:19:34] hasn't been a day when the United States [00:19:36] hasn't been trying to overthrow the [00:19:38] government of Venezuela. We saw them uh [00:19:42] greenlight a coup in 2002 where the US [00:19:44] ambassador, I think his name was Charles [00:19:46] Shapiro, was actually at the [00:19:48] headquarters of the coup. the NE and [00:19:51] USAD, these shadowy uh government [00:19:54] organizations that uh funnel money to [00:19:57] political organizations all over the [00:19:59] world, have very deep footprints in [00:20:01] Venezuela, sponsoring so many opposition [00:20:04] groups, whether that's political, [00:20:06] social, uh economic, nos, everything. Uh [00:20:10] they've been sponsoring, yeah, the [00:20:12] Venezuelan opposition for many decades [00:20:14] now. The US refused to recognize the [00:20:18] 2013 elections which saw Maduro come to [00:20:20] power. Uh they were the only country in [00:20:23] the world actually that refused to [00:20:24] recognize these elections. So the US [00:20:26] stood in splendid isolation and then as [00:20:29] we were talking about earlier under the [00:20:31] Obama administration since uh March 2015 [00:20:35] the United States has formerly been [00:20:36] under a state of emergency supposedly [00:20:39] because of the extraordinary threat [00:20:41] Venezuela poses to the United States. [00:20:44] And what these sanctions, which should [00:20:45] really be called a blockade or [00:20:47] unilateral coercive measures, mean is [00:20:49] that they've basically been trying to [00:20:51] destroy the uh Venezuelan economy. And [00:20:54] even though they haven't been able to [00:20:55] overthrow the government, they have had [00:20:57] uh significant success in uh making the [00:20:59] people of Venezuela suffer. But that was [00:21:02] really turned up to 11 when Trump was [00:21:04] elected in 2016. Trump, as we know, uh [00:21:08] supported Juan Guyaido. He green lit the [00:21:12] ridiculous Operation Gideon, often [00:21:14] called the Bay of Piglets, where um [00:21:17] former US Green Berets, led a group of [00:21:20] mostly Colombian mercenaries to try to [00:21:22] shoot their way uh into the presidential [00:21:24] palace and install Juan Guyaido as a a [00:21:27] dictator. They supported this ridiculous [00:21:30] um parallel government. And they've also [00:21:32] been engaging in incredible acts of [00:21:35] international piracy trying to um uh [00:21:38] take Venezuelan vessels uh from open [00:21:41] seas and um and uh seize the cargo [00:21:44] there. The Bank of England famously uh [00:21:47] seized nearly $2 billion worth of [00:21:49] Venezuelan gold and uh basically [00:21:51] transferred it to the parallel [00:21:52] government led by Guyaido. So there is [00:21:55] this very long history going back almost [00:21:58] from day one uh in Venezuela of the [00:22:00] United States trying to overthrow the [00:22:02] country and that's the critical backdrop [00:22:04] which pretty much none of the corporate [00:22:06] media outlets uh that you read about [00:22:09] Venezuela ever fill you in on. And so [00:22:11] the public are just generally uh none [00:22:14] the wiser on what's actually happening [00:22:15] in the country. [00:22:17] >> Absolutely. I mean, the media [00:22:18] specializes in not providing any sort of [00:22:20] historical context to US sabotage of [00:22:22] other countries so that they can [00:22:24] continue to manufacture consent for [00:22:26] these regime change wars. Um, but it [00:22:30] seems like the people in Venezuela are [00:22:31] not backing down. They're uniting more [00:22:33] than ever. Diego, Diego, we talked a [00:22:35] little bit about um this uh militia [00:22:38] that's being formed of nearly 8 million [00:22:40] people. Just a really incredible number, [00:22:43] but it really shouldn't surprise people. [00:22:45] We have a country that is dedicated to [00:22:48] to defending their country. I mean, and [00:22:50] I mean, if you think about it, if we had [00:22:52] a threat here in the United States where [00:22:55] a foreign government or foreign military [00:22:57] was about to invade here, we would have [00:23:00] a, you know, military that would [00:23:03] organize and we'd have probably citizens [00:23:05] join the military to support and defend [00:23:08] their country. So, it's not at all [00:23:10] surprising that that number is at 8 [00:23:12] million right now. Um, could you tell us [00:23:15] more about these militias, Diego, and [00:23:18] what their role is and how seriously [00:23:20] Venezuela is taking this threat of a US [00:23:23] invasion? [00:23:25] >> Well, you know, militia has been a [00:23:27] component of the armed forces ever since [00:23:29] the commandantes years since Chavis. [00:23:32] have been was formed [00:23:34] I'm not sure maybe Lonardo could help me [00:23:36] with this one but I think it was around [00:23:38] 2011 or 12 or even before but during the [00:23:42] the early decades and um as another [00:23:45] component of the armed forces I mean [00:23:47] that was during those years and it and [00:23:50] it had also yeah a territorial role and [00:23:53] sometimes they have secondary uh roles [00:23:56] in many aspects in security aspects or [00:23:58] organizing and social engagement ever [00:24:00] since it's not an it's not as [00:24:04] kinetic, let's call it that way, as [00:24:06] other components of course of the of the [00:24:09] armed forces, but it has been there ever [00:24:11] since. [00:24:12] So, and the rational behind it is quite [00:24:15] clear and also it has been clearly [00:24:17] stated also by our president recently. I [00:24:18] mean he said if something gets to happen [00:24:21] we're going to have a republic in arms [00:24:23] which of course this has to do also with [00:24:25] an asymmetric approach to to the threats [00:24:29] that we're dealing with regarding the US [00:24:31] and regarding also because you can't [00:24:34] like dealing one from the other of the [00:24:37] internal threats you since the last [00:24:40] election presidential elections last [00:24:41] year in July the 28 on [00:24:45] our interior minister Galos was told [00:24:49] couple of weeks ago in one of those [00:24:50] press conference showing one of the [00:24:53] recent one one of these terrorist plots [00:24:54] that was foiled in which involves by the [00:24:56] way Albanian Narco clans who operate [00:25:00] from Ecuador [00:25:02] US mercenaries and other from other [00:25:04] places and extremist extremist factions [00:25:07] of the Venezuelan opposition [00:25:11] which you have to think about that [00:25:13] especially now when they're trying to [00:25:15] mix one thing with the other as And what [00:25:18] about if there was some sort of [00:25:21] upheaval, some sort of turmoil going on [00:25:24] inside Venezuela when this all this [00:25:26] flotillaa all this task force arrived [00:25:29] into near our shores. It kind of you [00:25:33] know and and it's something that's not [00:25:35] uh that has happened before. It happened [00:25:37] in 2015 2016 with a criminal insurgency [00:25:40] that was brewing during those days. [00:25:43] Right after that it cames that we had [00:25:44] one of the most violent unconventional [00:25:46] warfare colorcoded revolution attempt [00:25:49] back in that year. So timing and pacing [00:25:53] I think it's essential here. So that [00:25:56] also explains the role of people who are [00:25:58] actually ingrained in their own [00:25:59] communities in their own territories who [00:26:01] knows everyone who knows also uh the the [00:26:07] land and the security demands it has in [00:26:10] order to make it even more [00:26:11] comprehensive. a thorough approach to [00:26:13] security in all levels. That's basically [00:26:15] the rational behind it. Of course, it [00:26:17] also has the classics elements such as, [00:26:20] you know, popular prolonged warfare like [00:26:24] Mau style and that kind of uh [00:26:26] documentation, let's call it that way, [00:26:28] that kind of doctrine. But it's always [00:26:30] it has been ingrained in in the national [00:26:32] defense doctrine ever since [00:26:37] and yeah, I think that it's important to [00:26:40] they all I mean they also have to some [00:26:42] extent also have intelligence roles and [00:26:44] they have social intelligence role. I [00:26:46] mean they're not part of the security [00:26:48] system itself but there are always [00:26:50] people who are well you know intelligenc [00:26:54] people knowing what's weird what's going [00:26:56] on around their own surroundings and [00:26:58] being able to report and to and to [00:27:01] seriously this is important assess what [00:27:05] the nature of those threats that we're [00:27:07] talking about because that's also part [00:27:09] of the of the equation let's call it [00:27:11] that way. So that's basically its role [00:27:14] ever since and um so now basically what [00:27:18] we've seen is just a big mobilization [00:27:20] towards uh raising the numbers even [00:27:24] higher and I might add this also I think [00:27:27] it has also a psychological effect a [00:27:30] deterrent effect I might add and I think [00:27:33] this also plays out in how the [00:27:35] psychological sphere of this moment [00:27:38] plays out if there wasn't this kind of [00:27:41] response the last couple of weeks. [00:27:44] probably the US assessment regarding how [00:27:47] easy how slam dunk-ish was to [00:27:51] intimidate to find some breaking point [00:27:54] inside Venezuela would have been would [00:27:56] it would have been more obvious and it [00:27:58] isn't because of this I think [00:28:01] >> well I think a lot of people oh go ahead [00:28:04] >> among I was just adding among other [00:28:06] aspects of course but that's that's a [00:28:08] that's an essential one [00:28:10] defin [00:28:13] >> okay and And um I appreciate you [00:28:15] explaining that. I think a lot of people [00:28:17] are curious, you know, uh why now? You [00:28:20] know, why is Trump doing this right now? [00:28:23] Like what is it about this moment? And [00:28:25] so, Leonardo, um I'm curious to know [00:28:28] what is your assessment on the situation [00:28:30] and why do you think Trump is trying to [00:28:32] invade Venezuela right now? And do you [00:28:35] think that they will actually follow [00:28:37] through? Yeah, I mean I think it's [00:28:39] interesting because right now there's a [00:28:41] very clear divide within the Trump [00:28:43] administration. On the one hand, you [00:28:45] have this kind of faction of MAGA [00:28:46] isolationist types who don't want [00:28:49] necessarily see a conflict in Venezuela. [00:28:51] And that faction is right now [00:28:53] spearheaded by Richard Grenell who among [00:28:55] other things is Trump's special envoy [00:28:57] for Venezuela. And it was thanks to this [00:28:59] faction that the United States and [00:29:01] Venezuela came to an agreement pretty [00:29:02] recently, less than about a little bit [00:29:04] over a month ago to not only give [00:29:06] Chevron a new oil license, but to free [00:29:09] the 256 Venezuelans who were held [00:29:11] hostage in the Salvador and torture [00:29:13] prison and to reunite some Venezuelan [00:29:16] children with their families. So the [00:29:19] other side of the coin though is the [00:29:21] Marco Rubio faction, the neocons who [00:29:23] really have had their eyes set on [00:29:25] Venezuela for decades as Allan was [00:29:27] saying and they have been push they were [00:29:30] first of all they were pushing against [00:29:31] this Chevron license from the beginning. [00:29:33] In fact, at one point Trump called uh [00:29:36] the Congress people from South Florida [00:29:38] crazy Cubans because they were [00:29:39] threatening to derail his big beautiful [00:29:41] bill if they if Trump gave Chevron a [00:29:45] license. So he didn't give them a [00:29:46] license until after the bill had passed. [00:29:49] But instead of giving instead of denying [00:29:51] a license, what he did was allow this uh [00:29:54] military deployment to the Caribbean and [00:29:56] ter. So that's one of the reasons why [00:29:58] now is because there's this fighting [00:29:59] infighting within the Trump [00:30:00] administration. Another big reason is, [00:30:03] you know, we're seeing Trump use the [00:30:04] rhetoric of crime not just against [00:30:06] Venezuela, but internally in the United [00:30:07] States. He's not only deployed National [00:30:10] Guard and ICE throughout Washington DC, [00:30:12] but he's threatened to do it in Chicago, [00:30:14] Baltimore, New Orleans, many other [00:30:16] cities. That goes along with what we're [00:30:20] seeing in Venezuela. And part of it, and [00:30:22] I and I think, you know, I was at a I [00:30:24] live in Washington DC and I was at a [00:30:25] rally last week just to against this [00:30:28] occupation of Washington DC, and I saw [00:30:30] dozens and dozens of signs linking the [00:30:32] occupation of DC to the Epstein case. [00:30:35] Right. So I think that is plays a role [00:30:38] as well in trying to uh change the topic [00:30:41] of conversation from Epstein to crime [00:30:43] and to Venezuela to anything else that [00:30:46] could stick. I don't know that an [00:30:48] invasion is eminent. You know, to invade [00:30:50] Venezuela, they're definitely going to [00:30:52] need more than the 5,000 Marines that [00:30:53] are on board these ships and more than [00:30:55] the pe the Marines that are training [00:30:56] Puerto Rico. They're really going to [00:30:58] need help from Colombia and Brazil and [00:31:01] from the regional bases they have all [00:31:02] around. Right now, those conditions [00:31:04] don't exist. But that's not to say that [00:31:06] there is no danger, right? The danger is [00:31:09] that the Trump administration is going [00:31:10] to start bombing inside Venezuela as [00:31:12] they just said that they've been [00:31:14] discussing over the past week. And then [00:31:16] at that point, we would see Venezuela [00:31:18] respond and something could escalate and [00:31:19] go out of control. To me, the reason or [00:31:22] at least one of the big reasons that [00:31:23] they deployed uh the fleet was to cause [00:31:26] kind of a psychological break within the [00:31:28] Venezuelan people and and more [00:31:29] specifically within the Venezuelan armed [00:31:31] forces. Because when we saw these ships [00:31:34] first arrive, if you looked at social [00:31:36] media in Venezuela, they were saying [00:31:37] things like, "Oh, now is the time for [00:31:39] the people to for the people in the [00:31:40] armed forces to rise up against Budo." [00:31:42] And they do this pretty regularly, but [00:31:45] you see the traffic spike when some when [00:31:48] the US is planning something. So they're [00:31:50] trying to get all these generals to flip [00:31:52] and it didn't happen. They're trying to [00:31:54] get the Venezuelan people to really rise [00:31:56] up against their government and it [00:31:58] didn't happen. Instead, the opposite has [00:32:00] happened, right? We've seen the armed [00:32:02] forces in Venezuela become more cohesive [00:32:05] and we're as Diego mentioned, we've [00:32:07] seen, you know, the people take more uh [00:32:09] more significant role in the defense of [00:32:10] the nation through the militias. [00:32:13] >> Alan, uh what do you think of Leonardo's [00:32:16] assessment? [00:32:18] >> Yeah, I think he's pretty much on point. [00:32:20] Ultimately, if they've only got 4,500 uh [00:32:24] servicemen as uh what has been reported [00:32:26] in the media, that's simply not enough [00:32:28] to stage some sort of large scale [00:32:31] invasion of a country that is uh you [00:32:33] know much larger than uh you know uh [00:32:37] it's not some like little place that you [00:32:39] can take over. In fact, 4,500 troops [00:32:41] might not even be enough to subdue [00:32:43] Chicago. Who knows? Um my sense is [00:32:46] probably that this is an operation to [00:32:48] try to put pressure on Venezuela and see [00:32:51] what happens. You know, put pressure on [00:32:53] the structure. Will cracks emerge? Will [00:32:56] generals, for example, try to defect? [00:32:58] Will there be mass panic? Um, the United [00:33:02] States of course has spent decades [00:33:04] trying to penetrate the Venezuelan armed [00:33:06] forces, particularly the officer corps, [00:33:08] and try to peel off uh people there, try [00:33:11] to find allies within uh the movement [00:33:13] that could potentially do its dirty work [00:33:15] for it. But yeah, it's not clear that [00:33:18] that's actually going to happen. And [00:33:19] it's also clear that this is obviously [00:33:22] not about drugs, as Leonardo has made [00:33:25] clear as well. Um, I don't think it was [00:33:27] the last time. I think two times ago [00:33:29] when I was in Venezuela, I spoke to [00:33:30] someone in the government, uh, William [00:33:32] Castillo. And normally we talk about the [00:33:35] Republicans and the Democrats as being [00:33:38] two sides of the same coin. They're [00:33:40] basically the same one party state, but [00:33:42] he said for Venezuelans, there is [00:33:44] actually a bit of a difference. And [00:33:46] generally, the Democrats don't favor the [00:33:48] sort of invasion of Venezuela. they [00:33:50] prefer the sort of sanctions and the NGO [00:33:52] uh the way of trying to change the [00:33:55] society. But uh people like Trump and [00:33:58] the people he surrounded himself are [00:34:00] real hardliners. You know in Trump's [00:34:02] first administration he uh reportedly [00:34:05] said that it would be quote cool to [00:34:07] invade Venezuela because quote it's [00:34:09] really part of the United States end [00:34:11] quote. So that's the sort of mentality [00:34:14] Trump has. you know, go in, bash him on [00:34:17] the head, take the oil. [00:34:19] Who knows what's going to happen when [00:34:21] tensions rise? There could be um [00:34:23] misgivings, there could be [00:34:24] misunderstandings, and something [00:34:26] terrible could happen. But I would say [00:34:28] that if the United States does uh try to [00:34:32] um engineer an uh a regime change [00:34:35] operation in Venezuela and it is [00:34:37] successful, I would predict that we will [00:34:41] see a massive spike in drug production [00:34:43] in Venezuela. Because if you look at [00:34:46] what happened in Afghanistan in the [00:34:47] 1980s, the United States wanted to [00:34:50] overthrow a leftist government in [00:34:53] Afghanistan. And they did it by funding [00:34:56] uh ultra reactionary uh conservative [00:34:59] Islamists like Osama bin Laden. And they [00:35:02] allowed the mujahedin to uh control the [00:35:04] opium trade making uh Afghanistan the [00:35:08] world center for opium production. [00:35:11] In Nicaragua in the 80s, the United [00:35:13] States tried to overthrow the leftist [00:35:15] government there. They sponsored the [00:35:17] Contras who were deeply involved in the [00:35:20] cocaine trade, flooding the United [00:35:22] States uh with cocaine. Um in Bolivia, [00:35:25] the Bolivia uh the government in the [00:35:27] 2000s kicked out the drug enforcement [00:35:29] agency and uh cocaine production dropped [00:35:33] off a cliff there. So when we see the [00:35:36] United States getting more involved uh [00:35:38] in the so-called war against drugs, time [00:35:41] after time, we see drug production [00:35:42] actually going up. So that would be my [00:35:44] prediction. Uh apart from that, I'm I [00:35:47] don't want to place any bets on what [00:35:48] Trump is actually thinking. But I I [00:35:51] think Leonardo hit the nail on the head. [00:35:54] >> Absolutely. And you know, just listening [00:35:56] to everybody and just un, you know, [00:35:58] because of us report press reporting on [00:36:01] this issue for such a long time and [00:36:03] myself and Allan have having visited [00:36:05] Venezuela, a lot of the destabilization [00:36:08] efforts that the United States has put [00:36:10] on Venezuela seem to be coming from the [00:36:13] same playbook uh borrowed from other [00:36:17] countries the United States has tried to [00:36:19] destabilize and overthrow their [00:36:21] governments uh similar to Venezuela like [00:36:24] that in Syria. Syria, Iraq and Libya. [00:36:26] Diego, do you agree with that [00:36:28] assessment? [00:36:30] >> No, absolutely. I mean, and you can even [00:36:33] there's like let's call it this kind of [00:36:35] crosspollinization between one [00:36:36] experience and the other one. I mean [00:36:38] each one enriches and updates the next [00:36:42] one. I mean and actually this if you I [00:36:46] mean there's a book by Greg Brandon for [00:36:48] example called Empire's workshop. [00:36:50] basically the and the central premises [00:36:52] of it is all these attempts all these [00:36:55] models that have been played out since [00:36:57] the early 20th century in Latin America [00:37:00] are the ones that are used that are used [00:37:02] afterwards somewhere else including even [00:37:04] dropping bombs in World War I. I think [00:37:06] it had to do with how they bombed in it [00:37:08] and and Dominican Republic in the early [00:37:11] years of 20th century. The same with [00:37:13] Nicaragua and also talking about Syria [00:37:16] when it all started it was the contra [00:37:19] model. I mean this weird third force [00:37:22] that got involved between the protesters [00:37:25] and the government and suddenly it [00:37:26] started disappearing and killing people [00:37:28] and and yeah extrajudically killing [00:37:31] people that later on it turned out it [00:37:34] was all these Wahhabi factions that were [00:37:36] doing this. That's a contra model. And [00:37:38] actually you had I forgot his name. [00:37:41] Robert Ford the ambassador for the US [00:37:44] there was number two from John Negro [00:37:46] Ponte Honduras. So it's it's clearly it [00:37:51] was a contraption back then. So yeah [00:37:52] what I'm saying here is it's clearly [00:37:53] connected and one experience brings to [00:37:56] the other and [00:37:58] perhaps the most the most obvious one [00:38:00] the there are two obvious connections [00:38:02] here. The first one it's I mean in this [00:38:05] empire toolbox which is one of them it's [00:38:08] um the nora experience for once which is [00:38:12] it has a different context and a [00:38:14] different evolution but of course uh [00:38:16] they actually got to arrest the guy [00:38:19] inside Panama after bombing the crap out [00:38:22] of Panama [00:38:24] and um but the other one it's even [00:38:26] closer to home to in time I mean which [00:38:29] is the WMD 20038 thing I They're just [00:38:33] exploiting a figment of imagination. But [00:38:36] there is a precedent here the same as it [00:38:39] as it was in regarding Iraq that [00:38:42] eventually at some point they did have [00:38:44] although they dismantled uh chemical [00:38:47] weapons program and even before that [00:38:49] they had like nuclear plants in 82 that [00:38:52] was actually you know was bombed by [00:38:53] Israel back then. But um in this case [00:38:59] uh and I'm picking up what Alan was [00:39:02] saying regarding the drug trade vene [00:39:07] during the 80s and the 90s actually [00:39:11] there was a major cocaine supply coming [00:39:13] from Venezuela ran by the anti-drugs [00:39:17] star in Venezuela who was a brigadeier [00:39:19] general from the national guard [00:39:25] Ramona. Yeah. [00:39:28] Who was actually at some point he was [00:39:29] indicted because he was caught trying to [00:39:31] send a ton and a half of cocaine after [00:39:34] he was already doing it a long time with [00:39:36] the help of the CIA. It was the DA who [00:39:38] caught him afterwards. There's even a 60 [00:39:41] minutes Max [00:39:43] posted the other day on Twitter. Max [00:39:45] Blumenthal. We were talking about it in [00:39:46] uh before and um it shows precisely what [00:39:50] they were doing, what some security [00:39:55] personnel in Venezuela was actually [00:39:57] doing, collaborating, sending cocaine to [00:39:58] the US in the '9s, just like in [00:40:01] Nicaragua, just like in Bolivia. So that [00:40:03] also stopped. That's the moment, that's [00:40:06] the actual origin of El Cartel de Solo [00:40:08] in singular back then. It was a name [00:40:11] that disappeared suddenly, but it was in [00:40:14] 2005 when Venezuela cut ties with the [00:40:16] DEA that it reappeared in a Miami Herald [00:40:19] piece by an unnamed top diplomat in the [00:40:24] country, which is easily to deduce it [00:40:26] was William Brownfield, of course. But [00:40:28] so there's this I mean the cart de loses [00:40:33] uh tag comes from a CIA creation back in [00:40:37] the '9s [00:40:39] during well [00:40:41] while they were funding themselves with [00:40:42] cocaine trade and then sending cocaine [00:40:44] to Florida. [00:40:47] Cocaine that was indicted in Venezuela. [00:40:50] So you have that element there and then [00:40:52] and then it of course it took a light of [00:40:54] itself life a life of its own throughout [00:40:56] the years but that connection I think [00:40:58] it's important the same with oil the [00:41:01] same which is far more obvious I mean [00:41:04] because the story thinks is a narrative [00:41:06] element [00:41:07] >> but also the way the unrestrained [00:41:09] oil supply that they had back then [00:41:14] it changed when Venezuela had well [00:41:16] sovereign government and started to [00:41:18] regulate the oil supply and opening [00:41:21] their opening our offer to partners [00:41:25] around the world and not an exclusive [00:41:26] relationship with the US. So this is [00:41:29] also part of it and part of of the of [00:41:32] the problem. Now regarding the other [00:41:33] element which is what could happen now I [00:41:37] also share the view of of of both my [00:41:40] friends here Alan and Leonardo [00:41:42] and you won't with 4,000 Marines you're [00:41:46] not going to do anything significant but [00:41:47] with 1200 AGis missiles you could I [00:41:52] think that's the main danger here and [00:41:54] also because like I was saying before [00:41:56] something also didn't add up the four [00:41:59] thousand Marines could make sense if [00:42:02] there was some internal strife going on [00:42:04] or some armed insurgency being [00:42:06] successful inside Venezuela which is not [00:42:09] happening. So regardless at this moment [00:42:12] in time where it's September the 10th [00:42:16] it's more about fear-mongering and [00:42:19] trying to find to reach some breaking [00:42:21] point in order to see if the government [00:42:23] collapses of the sort of or the society [00:42:26] rise up or whatever. Now they're in [00:42:29] social media you can see people already [00:42:30] wanting to do the Nepal thing you know [00:42:33] but it's at this point it's still just [00:42:36] there but it does do some harm [00:42:38] economically of course this has been one [00:42:41] of the best months in regarding oil [00:42:44] supply and oil sales from Venezuela and [00:42:47] you can't uh disconnect one thing from [00:42:50] the other one. So there's also a rush [00:42:52] here in order to not allow Venezuela to [00:42:55] even recover even more because when you [00:42:57] were here man in 2021 things were [00:42:59] improving already but things are are [00:43:01] better now. [00:43:03] >> I mean it's not that that there are not [00:43:05] problems we have major issues still and [00:43:07] we when we're still under the sanctions [00:43:09] program but um things are better than [00:43:12] they were before. So that's also I think [00:43:15] a reason that that they're pushing this [00:43:17] and there's another one. You can think [00:43:19] of Marco Rubio now as the most dangerous [00:43:21] president in the world even more [00:43:22] dangerous than Netanyahu and actually [00:43:25] one of the most powerful persons in the [00:43:26] world as well because he's has a dual [00:43:29] and not a dual a triple uh score there. [00:43:33] He is his state department I mean he's [00:43:36] the the state secretary. He is uh the [00:43:40] national security adviser interim but he [00:43:42] is and he also is the main interventor [00:43:46] of USAD. [00:43:48] So he has like three very important [00:43:51] power structures that actually deal with [00:43:53] this kind of things in a moment that you [00:43:55] know the world is going kind of bonkers. [00:43:56] Think about Nepal. Think about the the [00:43:59] the [00:44:01] armed confrontation in Cambodian [00:44:02] Thailand a few months ago, a few weeks [00:44:05] ago. Think about all this going on [00:44:07] precisely at this moment. And I and he [00:44:09] knows he can might be running out of [00:44:11] time. He know he could lose Trump's ear [00:44:13] at any given time and lose whatever. So [00:44:16] this is his opportunity. That's why he's [00:44:18] pushing so hard. [00:44:21] >> That's a really interesting uh analysis [00:44:23] about you know the world is in just [00:44:25] chaos right now and uh this is Trump's [00:44:28] moment to do what he needs to do in [00:44:31] Venezuela. I think a lot of people um [00:44:35] are curious to know is, you know, why [00:44:38] does the United States care so much [00:44:39] about overthrowing Venezuela? And I [00:44:41] think we answered that in different ways [00:44:43] um throughout this conversation. And [00:44:45] maybe one of the most obvious ones is [00:44:48] that the United States and you know, [00:44:49] companies like Exxon Mobile want access [00:44:51] to Venezuela's oil. Um but another [00:44:54] aspect is that Venezuela holds this [00:44:57] massive mineral reserve that the [00:45:01] military industrial complex wants to get [00:45:03] a hold of. The same kind of min minerals [00:45:05] that are fueling our our tick our tech [00:45:08] industry um for the same reason why [00:45:12] Congo has been uh the victim of [00:45:15] modern-day colonialism. [00:45:17] And so then we also have, you know, the [00:45:20] fact that Venezuela is building trade [00:45:23] agreements with countries like Iran, [00:45:26] countries like China and Russia, and [00:45:27] it's giving them access to the oil and [00:45:30] the minerals and not the United States, [00:45:32] but also because Venezuela was kind of [00:45:34] pushed in a corner, sanctioned and [00:45:37] didn't really have much of a choice [00:45:39] other than to create these economic [00:45:42] ties. Leonardo, can you expand on those [00:45:45] points? [00:45:47] Yeah, I mean I think we first have to [00:45:49] look back to when Venezuela was first [00:45:51] sanctioned and that was 2006 by the Bush [00:45:54] administration that imposed a sanction [00:45:56] on weapon sales. Up to that point, as [00:45:58] Alan and as Diego were saying uh in the [00:46:01] up to the '90s when Chhattis was [00:46:03] elected, Venezuela was a very close ally [00:46:05] of the United States and basically [00:46:07] bought almost its entire weapon systems [00:46:09] from the United States. So when Bush [00:46:11] does that, it forces Venezuela to go to [00:46:13] other countries for its military needs. [00:46:16] And one of the things about that [00:46:17] particular sanction was that it it [00:46:19] didn't allow any US components, which [00:46:21] most NATO countries that deal in weapons [00:46:23] use US components in one way or another, [00:46:25] forcing Venezuela basically to buy from [00:46:27] China, from Russia, and from Iran. So [00:46:30] that it's it's basically the United [00:46:32] States kind of shooting itself in the [00:46:33] foot and creating these conditions to [00:46:36] have some sort of adversary in South [00:46:38] America when Venezuela doesn't has [00:46:39] doesn't want to view that relationship [00:46:41] with the US as necessarily an [00:46:43] adversarial one. And when we look at why [00:46:45] the United States is going after [00:46:46] Venezuela, you mentioned it, right? It's [00:46:48] gold, it's oil, it's minerals, it's [00:46:50] gold, it's all these resources. Laura [00:46:52] Richardson, who was the head of Southern [00:46:54] Command, um, a a couple of years ago, [00:46:57] she did this really notorious interview [00:46:59] in which she basically listed all of the [00:47:01] resources that are in South America and [00:47:03] said that the United States has to do [00:47:05] whatever it can to get access to those [00:47:07] minerals and resources. So, this is a [00:47:09] long-term plan to take control not just [00:47:11] of of Venezuela's oil, but its rare [00:47:13] earth minerals, its boxite, its gold, [00:47:15] its water, whatever you want. The thing [00:47:17] is when Venezuela n reationalized its [00:47:20] oil industry under Chavez, it didn't [00:47:22] kick out the United States companies, [00:47:24] right? Chevron all has stayed in [00:47:26] Venezuela. Chevron's been in Venezuela [00:47:27] for over a hundred years if I'm not [00:47:29] mistaken. But Exxon left and Exxon left [00:47:32] because they didn't like the deal and [00:47:33] they sued Venezuela for about $10 [00:47:35] billion in these international courts [00:47:37] and they won an award of about a billion [00:47:40] a half dollars. And since then, Exxon [00:47:42] has had uh painted a target on [00:47:44] Venezuela. And what we're seeing now is [00:47:46] some of those the Exxon's labor comes to [00:47:49] fruition because Exxon has heavily [00:47:51] invested in Guyana and Venezuela and [00:47:54] Guyana have a border and they have a [00:47:55] border dispute that dates back to [00:47:57] colonial times. And now Exxon is using [00:47:59] this border dispute to kind of push uh [00:48:02] Venezuela onto a confrontation with the [00:48:04] United States. We have to remember that [00:48:06] the president of Exxon at one point was [00:48:08] Rex Tillerson and he was invested [00:48:11] heavily in Guyana right before he then [00:48:13] becomes Trump's first secretary of [00:48:15] state. And then Rex Tillerson as as [00:48:18] Secretary of State is one of the very [00:48:20] first ones in the Trump administration [00:48:21] to threaten a war on Venezuela to say [00:48:24] that if there's a coup in Venezuela, the [00:48:25] United States would welcome it. And so [00:48:27] we see all the paper trail that really [00:48:29] heads to Exxon trying to ferment and [00:48:31] trying to push for some sort of conflict [00:48:33] with Venezuela. So resources and control [00:48:35] of resources is a big part of the story [00:48:37] here. But another part of the story [00:48:39] because it's not just oil, it's about [00:48:40] geopolitical control. And since Chavis [00:48:43] came into power, Venezuela has, you [00:48:45] know, exercised an independent foreign [00:48:46] policy. And that for the United States [00:48:48] is a huge crime in terms of Latin [00:48:50] America because any country that tries [00:48:52] to exercise independence in a very real [00:48:54] way becomes under the foot of the of the [00:48:57] US government, whether it's Kuba, [00:48:59] Nicarawa, Venezuela, Bolivia, you name [00:49:01] it. And so that kind of explains that [00:49:03] it's not just oil because Cuba and [00:49:04] Nicaragua don't have the resources that [00:49:06] Venezuela has and yet they are under [00:49:08] very similar pressures. So there's all [00:49:10] these factors, but yes, of course, oil [00:49:12] and geopolitics are the two main ones. [00:49:16] >> Absolutely. And I I I know we don't have [00:49:17] a lot of time left, but I I want to end [00:49:19] talking about uh Gaza because, you know, [00:49:23] it's an it's a tragedy that's taking [00:49:24] place before our eyes. It's being live [00:49:26] streamed, a genocide um on our [00:49:28] smartphones. And uh when I was in [00:49:31] Karakas, I couldn't help but notice [00:49:34] walking through the streets uh graffiti [00:49:37] all over the streets of Karakas calling [00:49:39] Netanyahu a baby killer and uh fists in [00:49:43] solidarity with the people of Palestine. [00:49:47] And from what I know, Hugo Chavez made [00:49:50] Palestine a national cause for the [00:49:53] people of Venezuela. you know, Venezuela [00:49:57] has been resisting US imperialism on the [00:50:01] international stage, not just from, you [00:50:04] know, pushing back against sanctions, [00:50:05] but standing on the right side of [00:50:07] history and standing against US colonial [00:50:10] and Israeli colonial projects, including [00:50:14] Palestine. And so, I want to talk about [00:50:17] um how these two issues are [00:50:20] fundamentally part of the same story. [00:50:22] Alan, can you explain that to us? [00:50:26] Oh yeah, it's all part of the same world [00:50:28] system. They're so interconnected. [00:50:30] Um last year I was speaking to the [00:50:33] Palestinian ambassador in Caracus and he [00:50:35] said that Venezuela was the leader of [00:50:39] the world in terms of Palestinian [00:50:41] solidarity. And as you said, Manar, if [00:50:43] you go to Venezuela, you can really see [00:50:45] this. You can see Palestinian murals [00:50:47] everywhere, flags draped out there. Um [00:50:50] there's uh yeah, as I said, murals of um [00:50:54] uh famous Palestinian poets, writers, [00:50:56] you'll even see uh people like Hassan [00:50:58] Nazalla on the walls. And for the [00:51:02] longest time, I mean, Hugo Chavez, as [00:51:03] you said, made Palestine an issue. This [00:51:05] was more than 15 years ago, he condemned [00:51:08] uh Israel as a terrorist state and broke [00:51:10] off relations uh with Israel. And you [00:51:14] know even at the the last national [00:51:15] elections when President Maduro cast his [00:51:18] ballot and you know in front of all the [00:51:20] TV cameras what did he say? He said long [00:51:22] live free Palestine. That's what he [00:51:24] decided to say in that you know 5-second [00:51:27] sound bite where they would be played to [00:51:29] the nation and be played all around the [00:51:31] world. And on the other side of that, [00:51:33] Maria Karina Machado, which was who was [00:51:36] one of the the leaders of the opposition [00:51:38] in Venezuela, she said that uh our [00:51:41] struggle is Israel's struggle. That's [00:51:43] what her message was. So these things [00:51:45] are really completely connected in the [00:51:47] minds of people all around the world. [00:51:49] And you see this in Latin America as [00:51:51] well. If you see rallies for right-wing [00:51:53] forces, if you watch like a Bolsinaro [00:51:55] rally, there's always the US flag and [00:51:57] the Israeli flag there. And you know [00:52:00] when in 2019 when uh the coup against [00:52:03] Evo Morales happened, Israel came out [00:52:05] and immediately said this is a victory [00:52:07] against anti-semitism in the world. What [00:52:10] did he mean by that? I mean Israel is [00:52:13] actually has a considerable impact in [00:52:15] Latin America. I mean it trained [00:52:17] right-wing death squads around the [00:52:19] region. Um so much so that it's just [00:52:22] become normalized. I mean, the president [00:52:24] of Colombia, Juan, Manuel Santos, he [00:52:27] actually did an ad for an Israeli [00:52:29] mercenary firm while he was president [00:52:32] and he appeared in that. That's how [00:52:34] normalized the sort of um Israeli [00:52:36] military footprint is in many places in [00:52:39] Latin America. So, I mean, yeah, these [00:52:42] are all interlin. We're talking about [00:52:44] one part of the uh the global empire [00:52:46] here in another place. But ultimately [00:52:49] all oppressed peoples see themselves in [00:52:51] Palestine and all oppressors see [00:52:53] themselves in Israel. In fact, many [00:52:55] Latin Americans even see Israel as a [00:52:57] model, you know, a white settler [00:52:59] colonial state. That's what they want to [00:53:01] uh implant on their countries because [00:53:03] Latin America is very racially diverse. [00:53:05] But when we look at a socially and on [00:53:08] the class basis, the poor are mostly [00:53:10] black and the black are mostly poor. And [00:53:14] regardless of where you are, there's [00:53:16] always a light-skinned elite in these [00:53:18] countries. And so, yeah, the struggle [00:53:20] against colonialism and empire is the [00:53:22] same all around the world. And people in [00:53:24] the global south understand that. [00:53:27] >> One of the best trips and most memorable [00:53:30] trips I took was to Venezuela in 2021. [00:53:34] And I was extremely angered while I was [00:53:37] there. I was inspired by the movement, [00:53:39] but I was completely angered by the fact [00:53:43] that the United States was sabotaging [00:53:45] Venezuela in every way possible and [00:53:48] trying to suffocate the people there [00:53:50] through sanctions and preventing them [00:53:52] from importing very basic parts uh for [00:53:57] their machinery, for example, and [00:53:59] preventing lifesaving medicine like [00:54:02] diabetes medicine for the people in [00:54:05] Venezuela that were suffering. [00:54:07] Um but I was also completely in awe at [00:54:10] the kindness, the generosity and the [00:54:13] solidarity that people showed with the [00:54:15] people of Palestine. You know, I was [00:54:18] walking in Karacas with my hijab as a [00:54:20] Palestinian and I was like the only one [00:54:22] who looked like that and everyone was [00:54:24] just giving me hugs and you know, [00:54:27] putting their fist up for Palestine. was [00:54:29] really beautiful to see and so it was [00:54:32] just something I'll never forget. And so [00:54:34] I thank you all for um all of the [00:54:37] historical context that you provided and [00:54:40] helping us understand the situation in [00:54:43] Venezuela. But before we go, I just want [00:54:45] to say one more time that Mint Press is [00:54:49] in need of everybody's support who's [00:54:51] listening to this and watching this [00:54:53] segment. One of our main lines of [00:54:55] funding has been cut. And so we did [00:54:57] launch a campaign on Indiegogo and [00:55:00] please support us in any way that you [00:55:02] can. We are in an emergency uh [00:55:05] fundraising uh state right now. Thank [00:55:08] you so much gentlemen for joining me [00:55:09] today. [00:55:10] >> Thank you. [00:55:12] >> You [00:55:14] [Music]