Trump’s Cartel Hoax: How Washington Uses Venezuela to Sell War

[00:00:03] [Music] [00:00:08] Hello everyone and welcome to Midcast, [00:00:10] the official podcast of Mitpress News. I [00:00:13] am your host Manara Adley and I'm the [00:00:15] founder and director of Mint Press News. [00:00:19] It seems that the United States is ready [00:00:21] for yet another war, another [00:00:24] confrontation. It's trying to start a [00:00:26] war now with Venezuela. The Trump [00:00:28] administration has sent a fleet of [00:00:31] warships alongside thousands of soldiers [00:00:34] to the Caribbean, even blowing up a [00:00:36] Venezuelan ship it claimed was involved [00:00:39] in the drug trade. But Washington has [00:00:42] had its eyes on regime change in [00:00:44] Venezuela for decades, sponsoring coups, [00:00:47] opposition movements, and military [00:00:49] operations against the socialist [00:00:51] government. So, how close are we to yet [00:00:54] another forever war? It's almost like we [00:00:57] can't keep up from the current war that [00:00:59] the United States is backing with Israel [00:01:01] and its genocide and its occupation [00:01:06] and its agitation of other countries [00:01:08] including the latest bombing in Qatar, [00:01:12] Lebanon, Tunisia with the Sumud [00:01:14] flatillas. It is just ongoing and it [00:01:17] feels like we can't keep up. Um, but we [00:01:20] will be dismantling some of the [00:01:22] propaganda when it comes to this crisis, [00:01:25] uh, this buildup for an invasion of [00:01:28] Venezuela. I am joined by three people [00:01:31] today to discuss this issue. Joining [00:01:33] from Karacas is Diego Sequera. He is a [00:01:37] journalist, a writer, and local and with [00:01:40] the local media outlet Mission Verdad. [00:01:43] Also joining me is Leonardo Flores. He [00:01:46] is the co-founder of the Venezuela [00:01:48] Solidarity Network and a former analyst [00:01:51] with the Venezuelan Embassy in [00:01:53] Washington DC. And finally, we have the [00:01:56] brilliant Alan Mloud who's also here. He [00:01:59] is our senior staff writer and lead [00:02:02] investigative journalist at Mitress [00:02:04] News. and you know he has completed his [00:02:07] PhD on the topic of Venezuelan politics [00:02:10] and wrote the book bad news from [00:02:13] Venezuela 20 years of fake news and [00:02:15] misreporting. Make sure to order his [00:02:17] book and check that out. I feel so [00:02:20] humbled to be here with all of you uh [00:02:22] gentlemen. Um you guys are definitely [00:02:25] this is like the all-star team to talk [00:02:26] about what's happening in Venezuela and [00:02:29] of course I wish it was under better [00:02:30] circumstances. Thank you gentlemen for [00:02:32] joining me today. [00:02:35] Thank you, Lee. [00:02:36] >> Thank you. It's a pleasure to be on Mint [00:02:38] Press and I hope uh viewers continue to [00:02:39] support the great journalism that you [00:02:41] you all are doing. [00:02:43] >> Really appreciate that. And before we [00:02:46] get on into the show, I do have a [00:02:48] special announcement to make. If if [00:02:50] you've been following Mitress News, you [00:02:52] might have noticed that we launched a [00:02:54] recent campaign on Indiegogo. Mit Press [00:02:56] News is facing an ex existential threat. [00:03:00] After 14 years of providing fearless [00:03:03] independent investigative journalism [00:03:05] that holds the military-industrial [00:03:07] complex accountable, we are actually now [00:03:10] at risk of shutting down. Um, one of our [00:03:13] main lines of funding has been cut and [00:03:15] so we need every single person who's [00:03:17] watching us today to go on Indiegogo and [00:03:21] support our campaign. 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So, your [00:04:12] support means everything to us to help [00:04:15] us keep on going. Join us on Indiegogo. [00:04:19] So, let's um turn back to what we uh [00:04:23] were planning on talking to, which is [00:04:25] Venezuela right now. It's completely [00:04:28] disturbing what the United States is [00:04:30] doing, having its warships encircling [00:04:33] the country. The Trump administration [00:04:36] has placed a $50 million bounty on [00:04:39] President Maduro's head. So Diego, I [00:04:41] want to start with you. As someone who [00:04:43] is who is Venezuelan, who is there as a [00:04:46] journalist, what is the sentiment right [00:04:48] now inside of Venezuela with the United [00:04:50] States having its warheads pointed [00:04:52] directly at your country? What is the [00:04:54] situation on the ground right now? [00:04:58] >> Thank you, man. It's a pleasure to be [00:05:00] here and of course you know you're well [00:05:03] aware you got my full support given the [00:05:06] new challenges, a new round of [00:05:07] challenges for you. I'm sure you're [00:05:09] going to overcome [00:05:11] regarding the situation in here. Well, [00:05:13] you know, Venezuela has gone through so [00:05:16] much that the first noise I guess it's [00:05:20] not so paralyzing or shocking. People [00:05:22] are about their own business. I'm in a [00:05:24] very bustling area of Karakas which it [00:05:28] could be a good benchmark to measure [00:05:30] what how Karakas at least it's it's [00:05:32] behaving these days and it's it kind of [00:05:36] gives the impression that basically [00:05:37] nothing is happening or will happen but [00:05:40] of course this has to do with like I [00:05:42] said it has to a lot to do with this is [00:05:45] not the first time not even the first [00:05:47] time of of threats of military action [00:05:50] and um [00:05:52] and besides the point. I mean, until [00:05:55] something really happens, I think we're [00:05:57] going to we're not going to see the [00:05:58] actual reaction of people. But beyond [00:06:00] that point, I mean, during on the on a [00:06:02] more media and political level, you can [00:06:04] see also that uh our president has [00:06:07] called for enlisting in the national [00:06:10] militia uh which is a component of the [00:06:13] of our armed forces [00:06:16] couple of weeks ago and [00:06:18] a lot of people basically joined and [00:06:20] signed up. huge numbers they said and [00:06:24] they talk about even 8 million uh make [00:06:28] that whatever you want you want about it [00:06:30] I'm sure that it's a lot of people [00:06:32] anyways and um and you know this also [00:06:36] goes beyond the sphere of charisma [00:06:38] itself [00:06:40] there are I don't know how aware [00:06:43] the US is probably not I mean usually [00:06:45] this is also usually based on flaw [00:06:47] analysis that set up a strategy and um [00:06:52] and usually bring brings a lot of bloods [00:06:53] with with them that also at some point [00:06:56] becomes blowback. [00:06:58] I don't know how sure they are, how [00:07:00] aware they are of the let's call it the [00:07:02] nationalist vein, the environment vein [00:07:04] that not necessarily means that a [00:07:06] Venezuelan citizen necessarily supports [00:07:09] government support charisma [00:07:11] but when and even looking for change for [00:07:16] political change but one thing is to [00:07:18] have those ideas and another one is to [00:07:22] be threatened directly by the US for [00:07:24] regent change in this case because of [00:07:25] course you can clearly see through the [00:07:29] accusations of the cart or whatever. We [00:07:31] can talk about that further on. But um [00:07:35] you can't stop this and think that [00:07:39] people beyond that phrase is not going [00:07:40] to react or oppose. They're already even [00:07:42] opposition politicians that already said [00:07:45] that in any any given situation of this [00:07:47] sort hypothetical attack our president [00:07:51] it's Nicolas Maluro and this is our [00:07:53] country. We're going to defend it. Of [00:07:54] course there's also a fringe spectrum [00:07:58] here of people who are [00:08:00] some you can say uh wishful think [00:08:03] wishfulfully thinking and then you have [00:08:05] from the extremist factions of the [00:08:06] opposition you have people who are [00:08:07] actually craving for this because this [00:08:09] would do their work you know as in [00:08:11] finding what they call an easiest direct [00:08:14] way of breaking change which is not [00:08:16] that's part of this flaw analysis we've [00:08:18] been talking about. So [00:08:21] right now I mean like I said you don't [00:08:24] get the feel properly unless you check [00:08:26] out the news unless you are following [00:08:28] what the the recent states and with the [00:08:31] footage we've seen from southern Puerto [00:08:32] Rico or so or the you know what the [00:08:36] president the vice president Marco Rubio [00:08:38] everyone has been saying about [00:08:39] Venezuela. So [00:08:43] one has to be of course have to be [00:08:45] cautious and we don't expect the best of [00:08:47] the situation right now but there's no [00:08:49] fear on the street which is like the [00:08:50] main headline I would I would choose to [00:08:54] sum up the situation here right now [00:08:56] >> we're talking about a country who is led [00:09:00] by a revolutionary vision by Hugo Chavez [00:09:04] a workers revolution and he famously [00:09:06] called the United States the great Satan [00:09:09] and for good reason. I mean, Venezuela [00:09:11] has been the target of US imperialist um [00:09:15] sabotage against this country for [00:09:17] decades and including coups. And when I [00:09:21] visited Venezuela [00:09:23] a few years ago, Diego, you were one of [00:09:25] the people that hosted me there. I mean, [00:09:28] I was I was there as an independent um [00:09:31] election observer and I met with people [00:09:34] and I walked through the streets and it [00:09:37] was just so beautiful to see just how [00:09:38] much support people had for the [00:09:41] revolution that Nicholas Maduro was [00:09:43] carrying on. And it was obvious that [00:09:47] Venezuela is a country that res [00:09:50] represents resistance to US imperialism. [00:09:53] And it does not surprise me that every [00:09:55] single attempt that the US has made to [00:09:57] overthrow the government in Venezuela [00:09:59] has failed. They've failed. Every single [00:10:02] one of them because the people there, [00:10:03] the majority of the people stand with [00:10:05] the revolution and they stand with Hugo [00:10:08] Chavez and they stand with Nicolos [00:10:10] Maduro. So it would not surprise me that [00:10:13] 8 million people joined uh this force to [00:10:16] defend their country from US sabotage. [00:10:20] And so, Leonardo, um, you know, I think [00:10:23] it's really important that we break down [00:10:25] and dismantle the these, uh, neo narot [00:10:30] trafficking, uh, accusations that are [00:10:33] being [00:10:35] put on Nicholas Maduro himself. So, what [00:10:37] do you make of these allegations about [00:10:38] Maduro and about Venezuela being a drug [00:10:42] producing hot spot? [00:10:45] >> Yeah, I mean, all the evidence runs [00:10:47] counter to that to that claim, right? [00:10:49] that Venezuela somehow is a drug [00:10:50] producing hot spot. In fact, when we [00:10:52] look at the numbers, and these are [00:10:53] numbers that the DEA agrees with, it's [00:10:55] that Venezuela produces zero cocaine. It [00:10:58] does not grow cocoa leaf. It does not at [00:11:01] the at most at most 5% of the cocaine [00:11:04] produced in South America flows out of [00:11:07] Venezuela as a transit country. So, the [00:11:10] the bulk of the cocaine rather than [00:11:12] flowing out of the Caribbean flows [00:11:14] through the Pacific. We're talking 87%. [00:11:16] 70% and this is a figure that just came [00:11:19] out pretty recently that they estimate [00:11:21] that 70% of the cocaine in the world [00:11:23] flows actually out of Ecuador which has [00:11:25] a Pacific coastline. So this idea that [00:11:27] somehow the United States is sending its [00:11:29] warships to the Caribbean to the [00:11:31] Venezuelan coast or right outside on [00:11:33] international waters to protect American [00:11:36] citizens from drugs. It's ludicrous [00:11:38] because if you wanted to do that first [00:11:40] of all you wouldn't use the military for [00:11:42] that. We know we know from 50 years [00:11:44] almost of the war on drugs that a war [00:11:46] that has completely failed that [00:11:48] militarizing this war or militarizing [00:11:50] this problem rather is not a solution. [00:11:53] Secondly, the cocaine is hardly the big [00:11:56] problem in the United States right now [00:11:58] when we're talking about drug use and [00:11:59] overdoses and when we see people on the [00:12:01] streets of our cities that are suffering [00:12:03] from addiction. It's opioids, it's [00:12:05] fentinyl, it's heroin, it's other things [00:12:07] that not cocaine, right? Cocaine was a [00:12:10] big problem back in the 80s, early 90s. [00:12:12] Now, not as much. It's it's other drugs [00:12:14] that Venezuela doesn't produce at all. [00:12:16] Fentinel, there's no fentinel in [00:12:17] Venezuela that goes to the United [00:12:18] States. So, so, so this is a myth that [00:12:21] really we have to take down and we have [00:12:23] to debunk, right? And then when we talk [00:12:26] about these narco terrorism charges, I [00:12:29] mean, this is absurd, right? I mean, I [00:12:31] challenge anyone to name one terrorist [00:12:33] act that the Bolivarian government has [00:12:35] carried out in the past 26 27 years [00:12:38] since it was first elected. There's [00:12:39] there's none. The drug charges [00:12:42] themselves, you know, they they focus on [00:12:44] the trendawa. They focus on the cartel [00:12:46] dees, but then their own reports really [00:12:50] undercut their arguments. When I say [00:12:51] their own reports, I'm talking about uh [00:12:53] the United States intelligence services [00:12:55] and and other agencies. So, for example, [00:12:58] there was this memo that was uh leaked [00:13:00] in I think believe it was May from the [00:13:02] National Intelligence Council. And here [00:13:04] I'm going to read a quote where it says, [00:13:06] "The Maduro regime probably does not [00:13:08] have a policy of cooperating with TDA, [00:13:11] TDA's Trenderawa, and is not directing [00:13:13] TDA movements and operations in the [00:13:16] United States. [00:13:18] Venezuelan intelligence, military, and [00:13:20] police services view TDA as a security [00:13:22] threat and operate against it in ways [00:13:25] that make it highly unlikely the two [00:13:27] sides would cooperate in a strategic or [00:13:29] consistent way. So, right away, this is [00:13:32] the top levels of US intelligence [00:13:34] acknowledging that TDA not only doesn't [00:13:37] work with Venezuela, but that Venezuela [00:13:38] views it as a threat. And in fact, the [00:13:41] TDA was functionally destroyed by the [00:13:43] Venezuelan security forces in 2022, [00:13:46] 2023. And now what we have are remnants [00:13:48] of the TDA throughout the hemisphere [00:13:50] that kind of act as a loose network or [00:13:52] that trade on this TDA name to kind of [00:13:55] further their criminal enterprises. On [00:13:57] top of that, let me just read a quick [00:13:59] quote from the DEA's National Drug [00:14:01] Threat Assessment. This is a a yearly [00:14:04] report that the DEA issues. And in the [00:14:06] 2025 report, they say TDA members also [00:14:09] conduct smallcale drug trafficking [00:14:12] activities. So in this drug DEA report, [00:14:16] the only mentions of Venezuela are in [00:14:18] this two these two paragraphs about TDA [00:14:20] where they don't even say that it's a [00:14:22] cartel and they don't go into [00:14:24] naroterrorism. They say mostly that the [00:14:26] TDA uses engages in human trafficking [00:14:28] and smuggling and and and really uh [00:14:31] using migrants to their own ends and [00:14:34] does very little drug trafficking [00:14:37] that the so it undercuts the Trump [00:14:39] administration's argument about [00:14:41] naroterrorism completely. Furthermore, [00:14:43] and I'll just add in terms of cartel [00:14:45] roles, you know, I was looking back [00:14:47] through these drug assessment reports [00:14:49] for the past 15 years. Some of them [00:14:51] aren't publicly available, but in the [00:14:53] ones that were, and I looked at around a [00:14:55] dozen or so, the cartel, do you know how [00:14:57] many times it's mentioned? Zero times. [00:15:00] Zero mentions at all over the past 15 [00:15:02] years. So clearly, this is not a cartel. [00:15:05] It first of all, it's a cartel that [00:15:07] doesn't exist. Secondly, it's not any [00:15:09] sort of threat to the United States. So [00:15:11] what we're seeing is kind of the [00:15:13] political maneuvering by Marco Rubio and [00:15:16] other hardliners that really are more [00:15:19] interested in Cuba than Venezuela using [00:15:22] this kind of rhetoric of crime and [00:15:24] naroterrorism to push the United States [00:15:27] into a conflict with Venezuela. [00:15:29] >> Absolutely. And I think if the United [00:15:31] States cared about the war on drugs, we [00:15:33] wouldn't have had our US military [00:15:37] members, our soldiers, [00:15:39] you know, defending those uh poppy [00:15:41] plants in Afghanistan. Um, and I I want [00:15:45] to point out that Marco Rubio's [00:15:47] pronouncements about being tough on [00:15:49] drugs, you know, they really fall flat [00:15:51] when we remember his own brother-in-law, [00:15:54] Orlando Cecilia, was a cocaine drug lord [00:15:57] who spent over 12 years in a Florida [00:16:00] prison. So, you know, it's it's obvious [00:16:04] that Washington has always wanted to [00:16:07] gain back control over Venezuela's uh [00:16:09] oil and Venezuela's incredible uh [00:16:12] mineral wealth. Of course, we know that [00:16:15] this includes the largest proven oil [00:16:17] reserves in the world, but also [00:16:18] significant deposits of iron, natural [00:16:20] gas, gold, and diamonds, and other [00:16:24] minerals that are used for the uh for [00:16:26] military equipment. [00:16:29] And so Allan um you know there is [00:16:31] obviously a huge undertone to all this [00:16:34] which is that the US with that the US's [00:16:36] history of trying to provoke regime [00:16:39] change in Venezuela. Could you first [00:16:42] tell us what Marco Rubio has said about [00:16:46] Venezuela and then kind of give us a [00:16:48] history of the United States provoking [00:16:51] regime change? [00:16:54] >> Yeah, sure. So, Marco Rubio is a [00:16:56] Cuban-American Secretary uh of state and [00:16:59] he has really been a hardliner on [00:17:01] Venezuela for his entire career like so [00:17:04] many Cubanameans uh have. [00:17:07] Um we know what uh Rubio was doing in [00:17:10] the first Trump administration from [00:17:12] books like uh Mark Esper's tell all book [00:17:15] that came out. Mark Esper was the [00:17:17] defense secretary under Trump. You can [00:17:18] also read National Security Adviser, [00:17:21] John Bolton's book, The Room Where It [00:17:22] Happens. And basically what came out of [00:17:26] that it was that Rubio was one of the [00:17:28] super hawks uh in the cabinet really [00:17:30] pushing for regime change even pushing [00:17:33] for a potential military invasion of [00:17:36] Venezuela. Uh we might remember in 2020 [00:17:40] the uh United States tried to launch a [00:17:43] series of coups um trying to push Juan [00:17:46] Guyaido into the uh Mira Flores [00:17:48] presidential palace. During that time, [00:17:50] Rubio was really one of the strongest [00:17:53] supporters of that and he was probably [00:17:54] the brains behind it. You might even [00:17:56] remember him tweeting pictures of um uh [00:18:00] Gaddafi being uh lynched and uh [00:18:03] sodomized to Nicholas Maduro at the [00:18:05] time. So he was putting that out in a [00:18:07] public forum, you know, snuff pictures [00:18:09] basically uh trying to intimidate uh a [00:18:13] government and a foreign official in [00:18:15] that way. So Rubio, yeah, he's, you [00:18:18] know, one of these uh the real [00:18:20] hardliners. I did call him a mastermind, [00:18:22] but you know, frankly, it's it's clear [00:18:25] that he doesn't really understand a lot [00:18:26] about Venezuela. There was one time when [00:18:28] I remember he was on uh social media [00:18:31] talking about how uh the socialist [00:18:33] government is um is falling and and a [00:18:36] reason for this is because the uh the [00:18:39] dam in Venezuela had been uh destroyed. [00:18:42] but he'd completely misunderstood uh the [00:18:45] article and actually the uh the [00:18:47] journalist who wrote it came in and said [00:18:49] actually that's not at all what [00:18:50] happened. My name is Kamandam you've [00:18:53] completely misunderstood what's going on [00:18:55] here and yeah I mean he's he's a [00:18:57] ridiculous figure in so many ways. Um [00:18:59] but he is pretty typical for uh the US [00:19:02] whether it's Democrat or Republican in [00:19:05] the administration. [00:19:07] Before 1998 and the election of uh Hugo [00:19:10] Chavez, Venezuela was actually one of [00:19:12] the US's key allies in the region and it [00:19:15] was doing whatever it was told. [00:19:17] Basically, it would pump oil whenever [00:19:19] the United States told it to to keep the [00:19:21] prices nice and low. But all of that [00:19:23] changed when Chavez was elected. And uh [00:19:26] pretty quickly he realized that the [00:19:29] minerals wealth of Venezuela really had [00:19:31] to be directed towards uh benefiting the [00:19:34] people of Venezuela. And that put him [00:19:36] right in the crosshairs of the United [00:19:38] States. And so really I have to say for [00:19:40] the last quarter of a century there [00:19:42] hasn't been a day when the United States [00:19:44] hasn't been trying to overthrow the [00:19:46] government of Venezuela. We saw them uh [00:19:50] greenlight a coup in 2002 where the US [00:19:52] ambassador, I think his name was Charles [00:19:54] Shapiro, was actually at the [00:19:56] headquarters of the coup. The NE and [00:19:59] USAD, these shadowy uh government [00:20:02] organizations that uh funnel money to [00:20:05] political organizations all over the [00:20:07] world have very deep footprints in [00:20:09] Venezuela, sponsoring so many opposition [00:20:12] groups, whether that's political, [00:20:14] social, uh economic, nos, everything. Uh [00:20:18] they've been sponsoring, yeah, the [00:20:20] Venezuelan opposition for many decades [00:20:22] now. The US refused to recognize the [00:20:26] 2013 elections which saw Maduro come to [00:20:28] power. Uh they were the only country in [00:20:31] the world actually that refused to [00:20:32] recognize these elections. So the US [00:20:34] stood in splendid isolation. And then as [00:20:37] uh we were talking about earlier under [00:20:39] the Obama administration since uh March [00:20:42] 2015, the United States has formerly [00:20:44] been under a state of emergency [00:20:46] supposedly because of the extraordinary [00:20:48] threat Venezuela poses to the United [00:20:51] States. And what these sanctions, which [00:20:53] should really be called a blockade or [00:20:55] unilateral coercive measures, mean is [00:20:57] that they've basically been trying to [00:20:59] destroy the isan uh Venezuelan economy. [00:21:01] And even though they haven't been able [00:21:03] to overthrow the government, they have [00:21:04] had uh significant success in uh making [00:21:07] the people of Venezuela suffer. But that [00:21:10] was really turned up to 11 when Trump [00:21:12] was elected in 2016. Trump, as we know, [00:21:16] uh supported Juan Guyaido. He green lit [00:21:19] the ridiculous Operation Gideon, often [00:21:22] called the Bay of Piglets, where um [00:21:25] former US Green Berets led a group of [00:21:28] mostly Colombian mercenaries to try to [00:21:30] shoot their way uh into the presidential [00:21:33] palace and install Juan Guyaido as a a [00:21:36] dictator. They supported this ridiculous [00:21:38] um parallel government. And they've also [00:21:40] been engaging in incredible acts of [00:21:43] international piracy trying to um uh [00:21:46] take Venezuelan vessels uh from open [00:21:49] seas and um and uh seize the cargo [00:21:52] there. The Bank of England famously uh [00:21:55] seized nearly $2 billion worth of [00:21:57] Venezuelan gold and uh basically [00:21:59] transferred it to the parallel [00:22:00] government led by Guyaido. So there is [00:22:03] this very long history going back almost [00:22:06] from day one uh in Venezuela of the [00:22:08] United States trying to overthrow the [00:22:10] country and that's the critical backdrop [00:22:12] which pretty much none of the corporate [00:22:14] media outlets uh that you read about [00:22:17] Venezuela ever fill you in on. And so [00:22:19] the public are just generally uh none [00:22:22] the wiser on what's actually happening [00:22:23] in the country. [00:22:25] >> Absolutely. I mean, the media [00:22:26] specializes in not providing any sort of [00:22:28] historical context to US sabotage of [00:22:30] other countries so that they can [00:22:32] continue to manufacture consent for [00:22:34] these regime change wars. Um, but it [00:22:38] seems like the people in Venezuela are [00:22:39] not backing down. They're uniting more [00:22:41] than ever. Diego, Diego, we talked a [00:22:43] little bit about um this uh militia [00:22:46] that's being formed of nearly 8 million [00:22:48] people. Just a really incredible number, [00:22:51] but it really shouldn't surprise people. [00:22:53] We have a country that is dedicated to [00:22:56] to defending their country. I mean, and [00:22:58] I mean, if you think about it, if we had [00:23:00] a threat here in the United States where [00:23:03] a foreign government or foreign military [00:23:05] was about to invade here, we would have [00:23:08] a, you know, military that would [00:23:11] organize and we'd have probably citizens [00:23:13] join the military to support and defend [00:23:16] their country. So, it's not at all [00:23:18] surprising that that number is at 8 [00:23:20] million right now. Um, could you tell us [00:23:23] more about these militias, Diego, and [00:23:26] what their role is and how seriously [00:23:28] Venezuela is taking this threat of a US [00:23:31] invasion? [00:23:33] >> Well, you know, militia has been a [00:23:35] component of the armed forces ever since [00:23:37] the commandantes years since chavis have [00:23:40] been was formed. [00:23:43] I'm not sure maybe lon can help me with [00:23:45] this one but I think it was around 2011 [00:23:47] or 12 or even before but during the the [00:23:50] early decade and um as another component [00:23:53] of the armed forces I mean that was [00:23:56] during those years and it and it had [00:23:58] also yeah a territorial role and [00:24:01] sometimes they have secondary uh roles [00:24:04] in many aspects in security aspects of [00:24:06] organizing and social engagement ever [00:24:08] since it's not an it's not as kinetic, [00:24:13] let's call it that way, as other [00:24:15] components of course of the of the armed [00:24:17] forces, but it has been there ever [00:24:19] since. [00:24:20] So, and the rational behind it is quite [00:24:23] clear and also it has been clearly [00:24:25] stated also by our president recently. [00:24:27] He said if something gets to happen, [00:24:29] we're going to have a republic in arms, [00:24:31] which of course this has to do also with [00:24:33] an asymmetric approach to to the threats [00:24:37] that we're dealing with regarding the US [00:24:39] and regarding also because you can't [00:24:42] like dealing one from the other of the [00:24:45] internal threats. We since the last [00:24:48] election, the presidential elections [00:24:49] last year in July the 28th on, [00:24:54] our interior minister I was told couple [00:24:57] of weeks ago in one of those press [00:24:59] conference showing one of the recent one [00:25:01] one of these terrorist plots that was [00:25:03] foiled in which involves by the way uh [00:25:06] Albanian Narco clans who operate from [00:25:09] Ecuador [00:25:10] US mercenaries and other from other [00:25:12] places and extremist extremist factions [00:25:15] of the Venezuelan opposition [00:25:19] which you have to think about that [00:25:22] especially now when they're trying to [00:25:23] mix one thing with the other as And what [00:25:27] about if there was some sort of [00:25:29] upheaval, some sort of turmoil going on [00:25:32] inside Venezuela when this all this [00:25:35] frailia all this task force arrived into [00:25:38] near our shores. It kind of you know and [00:25:42] it and it's something that's not uh that [00:25:44] has happened before. It happened in 2015 [00:25:46] 2016 with a criminal insurgency that was [00:25:49] brewing during those days. Right after [00:25:51] that it cames that we had one of the [00:25:53] most violent and unconventional [00:25:54] warfare/colorcoded [00:25:56] revolution attempt back in that year. So [00:26:00] timing and pacing I think it's essential [00:26:03] here. Well, that also explains the role [00:26:05] of people who are actually ingrained in [00:26:07] their own communities, in their own [00:26:08] territories, who knows everyone, who [00:26:11] knows also uh the the land and the [00:26:16] security demands it has in order to make [00:26:18] a even more comprehensive and thorough [00:26:21] approach to security in all levels. [00:26:23] That's basically the rational behind it. [00:26:25] Of course, it also has the classics [00:26:27] elements such as, you know, popular [00:26:30] prolonged warfare like Maui style and [00:26:33] that kind of uh documentation, let's [00:26:35] call it that way, that kind of doctrine. [00:26:38] But it's always it has been ingrained in [00:26:40] in the national defense doctrine ever [00:26:42] since. [00:26:45] And yeah, I think that it's important to [00:26:48] they all I mean they also have to some [00:26:50] extent also have intelligence roles and [00:26:52] they have social intelligence role. I [00:26:54] mean they're not part of the security [00:26:56] system itself but there are always [00:26:58] people who are well you know intelligent [00:27:00] social intelligence people knowing [00:27:03] what's weird what's going on around [00:27:05] their own surroundings and being able to [00:27:07] report and to and to seriously this is [00:27:11] important assess what the nature of [00:27:14] those threats that we're talking about [00:27:16] because that's also part of the of the [00:27:18] equation let's call it that way. So [00:27:21] that's basically its role ever since and [00:27:24] um so now basically what we've seen is [00:27:27] just a big mobilization towards uh [00:27:31] raising the numbers even higher and I [00:27:34] might add this also and I think it has [00:27:36] also a psychological effect a deterrent [00:27:39] effect I might add and I think this also [00:27:42] plays out in how the psychological [00:27:45] sphere of this moment plays out if there [00:27:48] wasn't this kind of response the last [00:27:52] couple of weeks probably the US [00:27:54] assessment regarding how easy how slam [00:27:56] donkeyish was to [00:27:59] intimidate to find some breaking point [00:28:02] inside Venezuela would have been it [00:28:05] would have been more obvious and it [00:28:06] isn't because of this I think [00:28:09] >> well I think a lot of people oh go ahead [00:28:12] >> among I would just add among other [00:28:14] aspects of course but that's that's a [00:28:16] that's an essential work [00:28:19] left with that question. [00:28:21] >> Okay. And and um I appreciate you [00:28:24] explaining that. I think a lot of people [00:28:25] are curious, you know, uh why now? You [00:28:28] know, why is Trump doing this right now? [00:28:31] Like what is it about this moment? And [00:28:33] so, Leonardo, um I'm curious to know [00:28:36] what is your assessment on the situation [00:28:38] and why do you think Trump is trying to [00:28:40] invade Venezuela right now and do you [00:28:43] think that they will actually follow [00:28:45] through? [00:28:46] Yeah, I mean I think it's interesting [00:28:48] because right now there's a very clear [00:28:50] divide within the Trump administration. [00:28:52] On the one hand, you have this kind of [00:28:53] faction of MAGA isolationist types who [00:28:56] don't want necessarily see a conflict in [00:28:58] Venezuela. And that kind faction is [00:29:00] right now spearheaded by Richard Grenell [00:29:02] who among other things is Trump's [00:29:04] special envoy for Venezuela. And it was [00:29:06] thanks to this faction that the United [00:29:08] States and Venezuela came to an [00:29:10] agreement pretty recently, less than [00:29:11] about a little bit over a month ago to [00:29:13] not only give Chevron a new oil license, [00:29:16] but to free the 256 Venezuelans who were [00:29:19] held hostage in the Salvador and torture [00:29:21] prison and to reunite some Venezuelan [00:29:24] children with their families. So the [00:29:27] other side of the coin though is the [00:29:29] Marco Rubio faction, the neocons who [00:29:31] really have had their eyes set on [00:29:33] Venezuela for decades as Allan was [00:29:35] saying and they have been push they were [00:29:38] first of all they were pushing against [00:29:39] this Chevron license from the beginning. [00:29:41] In fact, at one point Trump called uh [00:29:44] the Congress people from South Florida [00:29:46] crazy Cubans because they were [00:29:47] threatening to derail his big beautiful [00:29:49] bill if they if Trump gave Chevron a [00:29:53] license. So he didn't give them a [00:29:55] license until after the bill had passed. [00:29:57] But instead of giving instead of denying [00:29:59] a license, what he did was allow this uh [00:30:02] military deployment to the Caribbean and [00:30:04] ter. So that's one of the reasons why [00:30:06] now it's because there's this fighting [00:30:07] infighting within the Trump [00:30:09] administration. Another big reason is, [00:30:11] you know, we're seeing Trump use the [00:30:13] rhetoric of crime not just against [00:30:14] Venezuela, but internally in the United [00:30:16] States. He's not only deployed National [00:30:18] Guard and ICE throughout Washington DC, [00:30:20] but he's threatened to do it in Chicago, [00:30:22] Baltimore, New Orleans, many other [00:30:24] cities. That goes along with what we're [00:30:28] seeing in Venezuela. And part of it and [00:30:30] I and I think, you know, I was at a I [00:30:32] live in Washington DC and I was at a [00:30:33] rally last week just to against this [00:30:36] occupation of Washington DC and I saw [00:30:38] dozens and dozens of signs linking the [00:30:40] occupation of DC to the Epstein case. [00:30:43] Right. So I think that is plays a role [00:30:46] as well in trying to uh change the topic [00:30:49] of conversation from Epstein to crime [00:30:51] and to Venezuela and to anything else [00:30:54] that could stick. I don't know that an [00:30:57] invasion is eminent. You know to invade [00:30:58] Venezuela, they're definitely going to [00:31:00] need more than the 5,000 Marines that [00:31:01] are on board these ships and more than [00:31:03] the pe the Marines that are training [00:31:04] Puerto Rico. They're really going to [00:31:06] need help from Colombia and Brazil and [00:31:09] from the regional bases they have all [00:31:10] around. Right now, those conditions [00:31:12] don't exist. But that's not to say that [00:31:14] there is no danger, right? The danger is [00:31:17] that the Trump administration is going [00:31:19] to start bombing inside Venezuela as [00:31:20] they just said that they've been [00:31:22] discussing over the past week. And then [00:31:24] at that point, we would see Venezuela [00:31:26] respond and something could escalate and [00:31:27] go out of control. To me, the reason or [00:31:30] at least one of the big reasons that [00:31:31] they deployed uh the fleet was to cause [00:31:34] kind of a psychological break within the [00:31:36] Venezuelan people and and more [00:31:37] specifically within the Venezuelan armed [00:31:39] forces. Because when we saw these ships [00:31:42] first arrive, if you looked at social [00:31:44] media in Venezuela, there were they were [00:31:45] saying things like, "Oh, now is the time [00:31:47] for the people to for the people in the [00:31:48] armed forces to rise up against Maludo." [00:31:50] And they do this pretty regularly, but [00:31:53] you see the traffic spike when some when [00:31:56] the US is planning something. So they're [00:31:58] trying to get all these generals to flip [00:32:00] and it didn't happen. They're trying to [00:32:02] get the Venezuelan people to really rise [00:32:04] up against their government and it [00:32:06] didn't happen. Instead, the opposite has [00:32:08] happened, right? We've seen the armed [00:32:10] forces in Venezuela become more cohesive [00:32:13] and we're, as Diego mentioned, we've [00:32:15] seen, you know, the people take more [00:32:17] significant role in the defense of the [00:32:18] nation through the militias. [00:32:22] >> Alan, uh, what do you think of [00:32:23] Leonardo's assessment? [00:32:26] >> Yeah, I think he's pretty much on point. [00:32:28] Ultimately, if they've only got 4,500 [00:32:31] uh servicemen as uh what has been [00:32:34] reported in the media, that's simply not [00:32:36] enough to stage some sort of large-scale [00:32:39] invasion of a country that is uh you [00:32:41] know much larger than uh you know uh [00:32:45] it's not some like little place that you [00:32:47] can take over. In fact, 4,500 troops [00:32:49] might not even be enough to subdue [00:32:51] Chicago. Who knows? Um my sense is [00:32:54] probably that this is an operation to [00:32:56] try to put pressure on Venezuela and see [00:32:59] what happens. You know, put pressure on [00:33:01] the structure. Will cracks emerge? Will [00:33:04] generals, for example, try to defect? [00:33:07] Will there be mass panic? Um, the United [00:33:10] States of course has spent decades [00:33:12] trying to penetrate the Venezuelan armed [00:33:14] forces, particularly the officer corps, [00:33:16] and try to peel off uh people there, try [00:33:19] to find allies within uh the movement [00:33:21] that could potentially do its dirty work [00:33:23] for it. But yeah, it's not clear that [00:33:26] that's actually going to happen. And [00:33:28] it's also clear that this is obviously [00:33:30] not about drugs, as Leonardo has made [00:33:33] clear as well. Um, I don't think it was [00:33:35] the last time. I think two times ago [00:33:37] when I was in Venezuela, I spoke to [00:33:38] someone in the government, uh, William [00:33:40] Castillo. And normally we talk about the [00:33:43] Republicans and the Democrats as being [00:33:46] two sides of the same coin. They're [00:33:48] basically the same one party state, but [00:33:50] he said for Venezuelans, there is [00:33:53] actually a bit of a difference. And [00:33:54] generally, the Democrats don't favor the [00:33:56] sort of invasion of Venezuela. they [00:33:58] prefer the sort of sanctions and the NGO [00:34:01] uh the u way of trying to change the [00:34:03] society. But uh people like Trump and [00:34:06] the people he surrounded himself are [00:34:08] real hardliners. You know in Trump's [00:34:10] first administration he uh reportedly [00:34:13] said that it would be quote cool to [00:34:15] invade Venezuela because quote it's [00:34:17] really part of the United States end [00:34:19] quote. So that's the sort of mentality [00:34:22] Trump has. you know, go in, bash him on [00:34:25] the head, take the oil. [00:34:27] Who knows what's going to happen when [00:34:29] tensions rise. There could be um [00:34:31] misgivings, there could be [00:34:32] misunderstandings, and something [00:34:34] terrible could happen. But I would say [00:34:36] that if the United States does uh try to [00:34:40] um engineer an uh a regime change [00:34:43] operation in Venezuela and it is [00:34:45] successful, I would predict that we will [00:34:49] see a massive spike in drug production [00:34:51] in Venezuela. Because if you look at [00:34:54] what happened in Afghanistan in the [00:34:55] 1980s, the United States wanted to [00:34:58] overthrow a leftist government in [00:35:01] Afghanistan. They did it by funding uh [00:35:05] ultra reactionary uh conservative [00:35:07] Islamists like Osama bin Laden and they [00:35:10] allowed the mujahedin to uh control the [00:35:13] opium trade making uh Afghanistan the [00:35:16] world center for opium production [00:35:19] in Nicaragua in the 80s. The United [00:35:21] States tried to overthrow the leftist [00:35:23] government there. They sponsored the [00:35:25] Contras who were deeply involved in the [00:35:28] cocaine trade, flooding the United [00:35:30] States uh with cocaine. Um in Bolivia, [00:35:33] the Bolivia uh the government in the [00:35:35] 2000s kicked out the drug enforcement [00:35:38] agency and uh cocaine production dropped [00:35:41] off a cliff there. So when we see the [00:35:44] United States getting more involved uh [00:35:46] in the so-called war against drugs, time [00:35:49] after time, we see drug production [00:35:50] actually going up. So that would be my [00:35:52] prediction. Uh apart from that, I'm I [00:35:55] don't want to place any bets on what [00:35:57] Trump is actually thinking. But I I [00:35:59] think Leonardo hit the nail on the head. [00:36:02] >> Absolutely. Yeah, you know, just [00:36:04] listening to everybody and just un, you [00:36:06] know, because of us report press [00:36:08] reporting on this issue for such a long [00:36:10] time and myself and Allan have having [00:36:13] visited Venezuela, a lot of the [00:36:15] destabilization efforts that the United [00:36:17] States has put on Venezuela seem to be [00:36:20] coming from the same playbook uh [00:36:23] borrowed from other countries the United [00:36:26] States has tried to destabilize and [00:36:28] overthrow their governments uh similar [00:36:31] to Venezuela like that in Syria. Iraq [00:36:33] and Libya. Diego, do you agree with that [00:36:36] assessment? [00:36:38] >> No, absolutely. I mean, and you can even [00:36:41] there's like let's call it this kind of [00:36:43] crosspollinization between one [00:36:45] experience and the other one. I mean, [00:36:46] each one enriches and outdates the next [00:36:50] one. I mean, and actually this if you I [00:36:54] mean there's a book by Greg Brandon for [00:36:57] example called Empire's workshop. [00:36:58] Basically, and the central premises of [00:37:00] it is all these attempts, all these [00:37:03] models that have been played out since [00:37:05] the early 20th century in Latin Dominica [00:37:08] are the ones that are used that are used [00:37:10] afterwards somewhere else, including [00:37:12] even dropping bombs in for World War I. [00:37:14] I think it had to do with how they [00:37:15] bombed in IP and and Dominican Republic [00:37:18] in the early years of 20th century. Same [00:37:21] with Nicaragua. And also talking about [00:37:24] Syria when it all started it was the [00:37:27] contra model. I mean this weird flip [00:37:30] force that got involved between the [00:37:32] protesters and the government and [00:37:34] suddenly it started disappearing and [00:37:36] killing people and and yeah except [00:37:39] killing people that later on it turned [00:37:42] out it was all these Wahhabi factions [00:37:44] that were doing this. That's a contra [00:37:46] model. And actually you had I forgot his [00:37:49] name. Robert Ford the ambassador for the [00:37:52] US there was number two for John Negro [00:37:55] Ponte Honduras. So it's it's clearly it [00:37:59] was a contraction back then. So yeah [00:38:00] what I'm saying here is it's clearly [00:38:01] connected and one experience brings to [00:38:04] the other and [00:38:06] perhaps the most the most obvious one [00:38:08] the mo there are two obvious connections [00:38:10] here. The first one is I mean in this [00:38:13] empire toolbox which is one of them. [00:38:15] It's um the Nora experience for once [00:38:20] which is it has a different context and [00:38:22] a different evolution but of course uh [00:38:24] they actually got to arrest the guy [00:38:27] inside of Panama after bombing the crap [00:38:30] out of Panama. [00:38:32] And um but the other one it's even [00:38:34] closer to home to in time I mean which [00:38:37] is the WMD 20038 thing. I mean they're [00:38:40] just exploiting a figment of imagination [00:38:44] but there is a precedent here s the same [00:38:46] as it as it was in regarding Iraq that [00:38:50] eventually at some point they did have [00:38:52] although they dismantled uh chemical uh [00:38:55] weapons program and even before that [00:38:57] they had like nuclear plants in 82 that [00:39:00] was actually you know was bombed by [00:39:02] Israel back then but um in this case [00:39:07] uh and I'm picking up what Alan was [00:39:10] saying regarding the drug trade Venez [00:39:16] during the 80s and the 90s actually [00:39:19] there was a major cocaine supply coming [00:39:22] from Venezuela ran by the anti-drugs [00:39:25] star in Venezuela was that brigade there [00:39:28] general from the national guard [00:39:34] yeah [00:39:36] who was actually at some point he was [00:39:37] indicted because he was trying to send a [00:39:40] ton and a half of cocaine after he was [00:39:42] already doing it a long time with the [00:39:44] help of the CIA. It was the DA caught [00:39:46] him afterwards. There's even a 60 [00:39:49] minutes Max [00:39:51] posted the other day on Twitter. Max [00:39:53] Blumenthal. We were talking about it in [00:39:55] before and um it shows precisely what [00:39:59] they were doing, what some security [00:40:04] personnel in Venezuela was actually [00:40:05] doing, collaborating, sending cocaine to [00:40:07] the US in the '9s, just like in [00:40:09] Nicaragua, just like in Bolivia. So that [00:40:11] also stops. That's a moment, that's the [00:40:14] actual origin of El Cartel de Solo in [00:40:17] singular back then. It was a name that [00:40:20] disappeared suddenly. But it was in 2005 [00:40:23] when Venezuela cut ties with the DEA [00:40:25] that it reappeared in a Miami Herald [00:40:28] piece by an unnamed top diplomat in the [00:40:32] country, which is easily to deduce it [00:40:34] was William Brownfield, of course. But [00:40:37] so there's this I mean the cartel de [00:40:40] loses [00:40:42] tag comes from a CIA creation back in [00:40:45] the 90s during well [00:40:49] while they were funding themselves with [00:40:51] cocaine trader and then sending cocaine [00:40:53] to Florida [00:40:55] cocaine that was indicted in Venezuela. [00:40:58] So you have that element there and then [00:41:00] and then of course it took a life of [00:41:02] itself life a life of its own throughout [00:41:04] the years but that connection I think [00:41:06] it's important the same with oil the [00:41:09] same which is far more obvious I mean [00:41:12] because the other things is a narrative [00:41:14] element but also the way the [00:41:16] unrestrained [00:41:17] oil supply that they had back then [00:41:22] it changed when Venezuela had the world [00:41:24] sovereign government and started to [00:41:26] regulate the oil supply and opening [00:41:29] their opening our [00:41:32] offer to partners around the world and [00:41:34] not an exclusive relationship with the [00:41:35] US. So this is also part of it and part [00:41:38] of of the of the problem. Now, regarding [00:41:41] the other element, which is what could [00:41:44] happen now, I also share the view of of [00:41:48] both my friends here, Alan and Leonard. [00:41:49] Look, and you won't with 4,000 marines, [00:41:54] you're not going to do anything [00:41:55] significant. But with,200 [00:41:57] Ages missiles, you could. I think that's [00:42:00] the main danger here. And also because, [00:42:03] like I was saying before, something also [00:42:05] didn't add up. the 4,000 Marines could [00:42:09] make sense if there was some internal [00:42:11] strife going on or some army insurgency [00:42:14] being successful inside Venezuela which [00:42:16] is not happening. So regardless at this [00:42:20] moment in time where it's September the [00:42:23] 10th [00:42:25] it's more about fearongering and trying [00:42:27] to find to reach some breaking point in [00:42:30] order to see if the government collapses [00:42:31] of the soldiers or or society rise up or [00:42:35] whatever. Now that they're in social [00:42:37] media, you can see people already [00:42:38] wanting to do the Nepal thing, you know, [00:42:41] but it's at this point it's still just [00:42:44] there. But it does do some harm [00:42:46] economically. Of course, this has been [00:42:48] one of the best months in regarding oil [00:42:52] supply and oil sales from Venezuela. And [00:42:55] you can't uh disconnect one thing from [00:42:58] the other one. So there's also a rush [00:43:00] here in order to not allow Venezuela to [00:43:03] even recover even more because when you [00:43:05] were here man in 2021 things were [00:43:07] improving already but things are are [00:43:09] better now. [00:43:11] >> I mean it's not that they are not [00:43:13] problems we have major issues still and [00:43:15] we still when we're still on the [00:43:17] sanctions program but um things are [00:43:20] better than they were before. So that's [00:43:23] also I think a reason that that they're [00:43:24] pushing this and there's another one. [00:43:27] You can think of Marco Rubio now as the [00:43:29] most dangerous president in the world [00:43:30] even more dangerous than Netanyahu and [00:43:32] actually one of the most powerful [00:43:34] persons in the world as well because [00:43:36] he's has a dual and not a dual a triple [00:43:40] uh score there. He is his state [00:43:42] department I mean he's the the state [00:43:45] secretary. He is the national security [00:43:49] adviser interim [00:43:51] and he also is the main interventor of [00:43:54] USAD. [00:43:56] So he has like three very important [00:43:59] power structures that actually deal with [00:44:01] this kind of things in a moment that you [00:44:03] know the world is going kind of bonkers. [00:44:04] Think about Nepal. Think about the the [00:44:07] the [00:44:09] armed confrontation in Cambodian [00:44:10] Thailand a few months ago a few weeks [00:44:13] ago. Think about all this going on [00:44:15] precisely at this moment and I and he [00:44:17] knows he can might be running out of [00:44:19] time. He know he could lose Trump's ear [00:44:21] at any given time and lose whatever. So [00:44:24] this is his opportunity and that's why [00:44:26] he's pushing so hard. [00:44:29] >> That's a really interesting uh analysis [00:44:31] about you know the world is in just [00:44:33] chaos right now and uh this is Trump's [00:44:36] moment to do what he needs to do in [00:44:39] Venezuela. I think a lot of people um [00:44:43] are curious to know is, you know, why [00:44:46] does the United States care so much [00:44:47] about overthrowing Venezuela? And I [00:44:49] think we answered that in different ways [00:44:51] um throughout this conversation. And [00:44:54] maybe one of the most obvious ones is [00:44:56] that the United States and you know, [00:44:58] companies like Exxon Mobile want access [00:45:00] to Venezuela's oil. Um, but another [00:45:03] aspect is that Venezuela holds this [00:45:05] massive mineral reserve that the [00:45:09] military industrial complex wants to get [00:45:11] a hold of. The same kind of min minerals [00:45:13] that are fueling our our tick or our [00:45:16] tech industry. Um, for the same reason [00:45:20] why Congo has been uh the victim of [00:45:23] modern-day colonialism. [00:45:26] And so then we also have, you know, the [00:45:28] fact that Venezuela is building trade [00:45:31] agreements with countries like Iran, [00:45:34] countries like China and Russia, and [00:45:36] it's giving them access to the oil and [00:45:38] the minerals and not the United States. [00:45:40] But also because Venezuela was kind of [00:45:43] pushed in a corner, sanctioned and [00:45:45] didn't really have much of a choice [00:45:47] other than to create these economic [00:45:50] ties. Leonardo, can you expand on those [00:45:53] points? [00:45:55] Yeah, I mean I think we first have to [00:45:58] look back to when Venezuela was first [00:45:59] sanctioned, and that was 2006 by the [00:46:01] Bush administration that imposed a [00:46:03] sanction on weapon sales. Up to that [00:46:05] point, as Allen and as Diego were [00:46:07] saying, uh, in the up to the '90s when [00:46:10] Chaveis was elected, Venezuela was a [00:46:12] very close ally of the United States and [00:46:14] basically bought almost its entire [00:46:16] weapon systems from the United States. [00:46:18] So when Bush does that, it forces [00:46:20] Venezuela to go to other countries for [00:46:23] its military needs. And one of the [00:46:25] things about that particular sanction [00:46:26] was that it it didn't allow any US [00:46:28] components, which most NATO countries [00:46:30] that deal in weapons use US components [00:46:32] in one way or another, forcing Venezuela [00:46:34] basically to buy from China, from [00:46:36] Russia, and from Iran. So that it's it's [00:46:39] basically the United States kind of [00:46:40] shooting itself in the foot and creating [00:46:42] these conditions to have some sort of [00:46:45] adversary in South America when [00:46:46] Venezuela doesn't has doesn't want to [00:46:48] view that relationship with US as [00:46:50] necessarily an adversarial one. And when [00:46:52] we look at why the United States is [00:46:54] going after Venezuela, you mentioned it, [00:46:56] right? It's go, it's oil, it's minerals, [00:46:58] it's gold, it's all these resources. [00:47:00] Laura Richardson, who was the head of [00:47:02] Southern Command, um, a couple of years [00:47:04] ago, she did this really notorious [00:47:06] interview in which she basically listed [00:47:09] all of the resources that are in South [00:47:11] America and said that the United States [00:47:12] has to do whatever it can to get access [00:47:15] to those minerals and resources. So this [00:47:17] is a long-term plan to take control not [00:47:19] just of of Venezuela's oil but its rare [00:47:21] earth mineral oils, its boxite, its [00:47:23] gold, its water, whatever you want. The [00:47:25] thing is when Venezuela n reationalized [00:47:28] its oil industry under Tabes, it didn't [00:47:30] kick out the United States companies, [00:47:32] right? Chevron all has stayed in [00:47:34] Venezuela. Chevron's been in Venezuela [00:47:35] for over a hundred years if I'm not [00:47:37] mistaken. But Exxon left and Exxon left [00:47:40] because they didn't like the deal and [00:47:41] they sued Venezuela for about 10 billion [00:47:43] dollars in these international courts [00:47:45] and they won an award of about a billion [00:47:48] and a half dollars and since then Exxon [00:47:50] has had uh painted a target on Venezuela [00:47:53] and what we're seeing now is some of [00:47:55] those the Exxon's labor comes to [00:47:57] fruition because Exxon has heavily [00:47:59] invested in Guyana and Venezuela and [00:48:02] Guyana have a border and they have a [00:48:03] border dispute that dates back to [00:48:05] colonial times and now Exxon is using [00:48:07] this border dispute to kind of push [00:48:10] Venezuela onto a confrontation with the [00:48:12] United States. We have to remember that [00:48:14] the president of Exxon at one point was [00:48:16] Rex Tillerson and he was invested [00:48:19] heavily in Guyana right before he then [00:48:21] becomes Trump's first secretary of [00:48:24] state. And then Rex Tillerson as as [00:48:26] Secretary of State is one of the very [00:48:28] first ones in the Trump administration [00:48:30] to threaten a war on Venezuela to say [00:48:32] that if there's a coup in Venezuela, the [00:48:33] United States would welcome it. And so [00:48:35] we see all the paper trail that really [00:48:37] heads to Exxon trying to ferment and [00:48:39] trying to push for some sort of conflict [00:48:41] with Venezuela. So resources and control [00:48:43] of resources is a big part of the story [00:48:45] here. But another part of the story [00:48:47] because it's not just oil. It's about [00:48:49] geopolitical control. And since Chavis [00:48:51] came into power, Venezuela has, you [00:48:53] know, exercised an independent foreign [00:48:54] policy. And that for the United States [00:48:56] is a huge crime in terms of Latin [00:48:58] America because any country that tries [00:49:00] to exercise independence in a very real [00:49:02] way becomes under the foot of the of the [00:49:05] US government whether it's Cuba, [00:49:07] Nicarawa, Venezuela, Bolivia, you name [00:49:09] it. And so that kind of explains that [00:49:11] it's not just oil because Cuba and [00:49:12] Nicaragua don't have the resources that [00:49:15] Venezuela has and yet they are under [00:49:16] very similar pressures. So there's all [00:49:18] these factors but yes, of course, oil [00:49:20] and geopolitics are the two main ones. [00:49:24] >> Absolutely. And I I I know we don't have [00:49:25] a lot of time left, but I I want to end [00:49:28] talking about uh Gaza because, you know, [00:49:31] it's an it's a tragedy that's taking [00:49:32] place before our eyes. It's being live [00:49:34] streamed, a genocide um on our [00:49:36] smartphones. And uh when I was in [00:49:39] Karakas, I couldn't help but notice [00:49:42] walking through the streets uh graffiti [00:49:45] all over the streets of Karakas calling [00:49:47] Netanyahu a baby killer and uh fists in [00:49:52] solidarity with the people of Palestine. [00:49:55] And from what I know, Hugo Chavez made [00:49:58] Palestine a national cause for the [00:50:01] people of Venezuela. You know, Venezuela [00:50:05] has been resisting US imperialism on the [00:50:09] international stage, not just from, you [00:50:12] know, pushing back against sanctions, [00:50:13] but standing on the right side of [00:50:15] history and standing against US colonial [00:50:19] and Israeli colonial projects, including [00:50:22] Palestine. And so I want to talk about [00:50:25] um how these two issues are [00:50:28] fundamentally part of the same story. [00:50:30] Alan, can you explain that to us? [00:50:34] Oh yeah, it's all part of the same world [00:50:36] system. They're so interconnected. [00:50:39] Um last year I was speaking to the [00:50:41] Palestinian ambassador in Caracus and he [00:50:43] said that Venezuela was the leader of [00:50:47] the world in terms of Palestinian [00:50:49] solidarity. And as you said, Manar, if [00:50:51] you go to Venezuela, you can really see [00:50:53] this. You can see Palestinian murals [00:50:56] everywhere, flags draped out there. Um [00:50:59] there's uh yeah, as I said, murals of um [00:51:02] uh famous Palestinian poets, writers, [00:51:04] you'll even see uh people like Hassan [00:51:07] Nala on the walls. And for the longest [00:51:10] time, I mean, Hugo Chavez, as you said, [00:51:12] made Palestine an issue. This was more [00:51:14] than 15 years ago, he condemned uh [00:51:16] Israel as a terrorist state and broke [00:51:18] off relations uh with Israel. And you [00:51:22] know even at the the last national [00:51:24] elections when President Maduro cast his [00:51:26] ballot and you know in front of all the [00:51:28] TV cameras what did he say? He said long [00:51:30] live free Palestine. That's what he [00:51:32] decided to say in that you know 5-second [00:51:35] sound bite where they would be played to [00:51:37] the nation and be played all around the [00:51:39] world. And on the other side of that, [00:51:41] Maria Karina Machado, which was who was [00:51:44] uh one of the the the leaders of the [00:51:46] opposition in Venezuela, she said that [00:51:48] uh our struggle is Israel's struggle. [00:51:51] That's what her message was. So these [00:51:53] things are really completely connected [00:51:54] in the minds of people all around the [00:51:56] world. And you see this in Latin America [00:51:58] as well. If you see rallies for [00:52:01] right-wing forces, if you watch like a [00:52:03] Bsanaro rally, there's always the US [00:52:05] flag and the Israeli flag there. And you [00:52:08] know when in 2019 when uh the coup [00:52:10] against Ebo Morales happened, Israel [00:52:13] came out and immediately said this is a [00:52:14] victory against anti-semitism in the [00:52:17] world. What did he mean by that? I mean [00:52:19] Israel is actually has a considerable [00:52:22] impact in Latin America. I mean it [00:52:24] trained right-wing death squads around [00:52:27] the region. Um so much so that it's just [00:52:30] become normalized. I mean, the president [00:52:32] of Colombia, Juan, Manuel Santos, he [00:52:35] actually did an ad for an Israeli [00:52:37] mercenary firm while he was president [00:52:40] and he appeared in that. That's how [00:52:42] normalized the sort of um Israeli [00:52:44] military footprint is in many places in [00:52:47] Latin America. So, I mean, yeah, these [00:52:50] are all interlin. We're talking about [00:52:52] one part of the uh the global empire [00:52:54] here and another place. But ultimately [00:52:57] all oppressed peoples see themselves in [00:52:59] Palestine and all oppressors see [00:53:01] themselves in Israel. In fact, many [00:53:04] Latin Americans even see Israel as a [00:53:05] model, you know, a white settler [00:53:07] colonial state. That's what they want to [00:53:09] uh implant on their countries because [00:53:11] Latin America is very racially diverse. [00:53:13] But when we look at socially and on the [00:53:16] class basis, the poor are mostly black [00:53:18] and the black are mostly poor. And [00:53:22] regardless of where you are, there's [00:53:24] always a light-skinned elite in these [00:53:26] countries. And so, yeah, the struggle [00:53:28] against colonialism and empire is the [00:53:30] same all around the world. And people in [00:53:32] the global south understand that. [00:53:35] >> One of the best trips and most memorable [00:53:38] trips I took was to Venezuela in 2021. [00:53:42] And I was extremely angered while I was [00:53:45] there. I was inspired by the movement, [00:53:48] but I was completely angered by the fact [00:53:51] that the United States was sabotaging [00:53:53] Venezuela in every way possible and [00:53:56] trying to suffocate the people there [00:53:58] through sanctions and preventing them [00:54:00] from importing very basic parts uh for [00:54:05] their machinery, for example, and [00:54:08] preventing lifesaving medicine like [00:54:11] diabetes medicine for the people in [00:54:13] Venezuela that were suffering. [00:54:15] Um, but I was also completely in awe at [00:54:18] the kindness, the generosity, and the [00:54:21] solidarity that people showed with the [00:54:23] people of Palestine. You know, I was [00:54:26] walking in Karacas with my hijab as a [00:54:28] Palestinian, and I was like the only one [00:54:30] who looked like that. And everyone was [00:54:33] just giving me hugs and, you know, [00:54:35] putting their fist up for Palestine. It [00:54:37] was really beautiful to see. And so, it [00:54:40] was just something I'll never forget. [00:54:42] And so I thank you all for um all of the [00:54:45] historical context that you provided and [00:54:48] helping us understand the situation in [00:54:51] Venezuela. But before we go, I just want [00:54:53] to say one more time that Mint Press is [00:54:57] in need of everybody's support who's [00:54:59] listening to this and watching this [00:55:01] segment. One of our main lines of [00:55:03] funding has been cut. And so we did [00:55:05] launch a campaign on Indiegogo. And [00:55:08] please support us in any way that you [00:55:10] can. We are in an emergency uh [00:55:13] fundraising uh state right now. Thank [00:55:16] you so much gentlemen for joining me [00:55:18] today.