EFTA00114723.pdf

1 2 APPEARANCES: OFFICE OF THE INSPECTOR GENERAL BY: BY: WITNESS: DIGITALLY RECORDED SWORN STATEMENT OF OTHER APPEARANCES: NONE OIG CASE #: 2019-010614 DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE OFFICE OF THE INSPECTOR GENERAL AUGUST 4, 2021 RESOLUTE DOCUMENTATION SERVICES 3 4 1 MR. The recorder is on. My 1 credentials. 2 name is and I am a Senior 2 MS. : Thank you. And I'm 3 Special Agent with the U.S. Department of 3 , 4 Justice, Office of the Inspector General, New 4 MR. Okay. And what is your 5 York Field Office, and these are my 5 position? 6 credentials. 6 MS. : Supervisory Correctional 7 MS. : Okay. 7 Systems Suecialist. 8 MR. This interview with 8 MR. Great. Thank you. This 9 Federal Bureau of Prisons employee 9 is an official DOJ/OIG investigation into the 10 is being conducted as part of an official U.S. 10 death of inmate Jeffrey Epstein, and the 11 Department of Justice, Office of the Inspector 11 surrounding circumstances, and you are being 12 General, DOJ/OIG investigation. Today's date 12 asked to voluntarily provide answers to our 13 is August 4, 2021, and the time is 1:22 p.m. 13 questions. Will you agree to a voluntary 14 This interview is being conducted at the 14 interview with the DOJ/OIG? 15 Metropolitan Correctional Center, the MCC, 15 MS. : Yes. 16 located in New York, New York. Also present is 16 MR. : Thank you. So, there's a 17 DOJ/OIG Special Agent . This 17 form here. It's the United States Department 18 interview will be recorded by me, SSA 18 of Justice, Office of the Inspector General, 19 . 19 Warnings and Assurances to Employee Requested 20 Could everyone please identify themselves 20 to Provide Information on a Voluntary Basis. 21 for the record and spell your last name. To 21 "You are being asked to provide information as 22 start a'ain I am DOJ OIG Senior Siecial Agent 22 part of an investigation being conducted by the 23 . 23 Office of the Inspector General. This 24 MR. : This is DOJ/OIG Special Agent 24 investigation is being conducted, pursuant to 25 , , and these are my 25 the Inspector General Act of 1978, as amended. EFTA00114723  6 1 This investigation pertains to job performance 1 says employee's signature. If you sign there, 2 failure and security failure. This is a 2 and then em loyee's name -- 3 voluntary interview. Accordingly, you do not 3 MS. • Okay. 4 have to answer questions. No disciplinary 4 MR. -- you can print your 5 action will be taken against you if you choose 5 name there. Thank you. 6 not to answer questions. Any statements you 6 MS. : You want my whole name? I'll 7 furnish may be used as evidence in any future 7 put it on there. (Indiscernible *00:02:38) 8 criminal proceedings or agency disciplinary 8 What time is it? 9 proceedings, or both." 9 MR. p.m. 10 And there's a waiver section. It says, "I 10 MR. : Thank you for completing 11 understand the warnings and assurances stated 11 that. I can fill in the rest, though. 12 above, and I am willing to make a statement and 12 MS. May. 13 answer questions. No promises or threats have 13 MR. : So, where it says, 14 been made to me, and no pressure or coercion of 14 employee's name, is it something other than 15 any kind has been used against me." 15 IIIII or -- 16 So, again, it's just reminding you that 16 MS. : No. That's me. 17 you do not have to answer our questions. If 17 MR. : Oh, that's a W? 18 there's something you feel uncomfortable with 18 MS. Yeah, that's a W. 19 or if you want to stop at any time, you can 19 MR. : Oh, I thought it was a G. 20 say, yep, I can, I'm done. 20 MS. Oh, no, that's a W. 21 MS. • Okay. 21 MR. : Thank you. I'm filling 22 MR. : Make sense? 22 in the MCC New York as the place. And I'm 23 MS. : Yes. 23 oin to sign. Again, this is 24 MR. : Awesome. So, if you 24 and print my name. And Special 25 agree with that, here, you can review this. It 25 Agent can you please sign? 7 8 1 MR. : This is Agent . I'm 1 MR. : Thank ou. And 'our DOB? 2 signing as the witness. 2 MS. 3 MR. : All right. And if any of 3 MR. 4 these, you don't feel comfortable answering, 4 MS. : My date of birth? Oh, 5 that's totall fine. 5 6 MS. : Okay. 6 MR. Well, welcome. What's 7 MR. : This is just to verify 7 your social securit number? 8 who you are. Oh, first, before we start, I 8 MS. 9 need to place you under oath. Can you please 9 MR. And vihat is your current 10 raise your ri ht hand? 10 cellphone number? 11 MS. : Uh-huh. 11 MS. 12 MR. : Do you swear to tell the 12 MR. And what is your highest 13 truth and nothing but the truth during this 13 level of education? 14 interview? 14 MS. : Associates Degree. 15 MS. : Yes. 15 MR. And what is that degree 16 MR. Awesome. And if there is 16 in? 17 anything you don't understand or you want me to 17 MS. : In Criminal Justice. 18 rephrase or ask it another way, please, by all 18 MR. And where is that from? 19 means -- 19 MS. 20 MS. : Okay. 20 MR. And where is that? 21 MR. -- ask me to do so and I 21 MS. 22 will. What is your current home address? 22 MR. In 23 MS. 23 MS. Uh-huh. 24 24 MR. Is, the name of the, 25 25 what's the town? EFTA00114724  9 10 1 MS. : I don't, 1 MR. Great. Do you have any 2 It's an online school. 2 military service? 3 MR. • Oh, okay. 3 MS. : No. 4 MS. : A nationally-accredited online 4 MR. : Okay. And how long have 5 school. 5 you served with the Bureau of Prisons? 6 MR. Okay, great. And when 6 MS. : It's 20 years, 20-1/2 years, 7 did you attend? 7 it will be 21 in A ril. 8 MS. : I attended in 2017, and I 8 MR. : Do you recall your Enter 9 finished in 2019. 9 on Duty date? 10 MR. : Okay. Great. And what 10 MS. : April 2000. I don't know the 11 did you dp_prior to working for the BOP? 11 day, but I know the year, 2001. 12 MS. IIIII: I used to work for Berks 12 MR. : So April 2001? 13 County, in Reading, Pennsylvania. I used to 13 MS. : Uh-huh. 14 work for a detention center. They used to 14 MR. : Great. And when did you, 15 contract illegal immigrant kids and stuff like 15 do you remember when you went to BOP training, 16 that, for the 16 when you graduated? 17 MR. : Okay. And when did you 17 MS. IIIII: I went in August of 2001. I 18 do that? 18 went in, yeah, August, either July or August, 19 MS. : I did that in, I started here 19 and I came back a week before 9/11 hit. 20 in 2001. I started there, I think it was in 20 MR. : Okay. And what is your 21 1998, '97, '98. 21 current position with the BOP? 22 MR. : So you did that for, 22 MS. : Supervisory Correctional 23 like, three or four years? 23 Systems 24 MS. : Yeah, three or four years, 24 MR. : Are you familiar with 25 yes. 25 Jeffrey Epstein? 11 12 1 MS. : Yeah. I heard, he's all on 1 MR. • And you supervise all of 2 the news and stuff like that, and he was here. 2 that staff? 3 So, yeah. 3 MS. : Uh-huh. 4 MR. Okay. Great. Sorry. 4 MR. And how long have you 5 I'm going to circle back to that last question. 5 been -- 6 MS. : Okay. 6 MS. : Yeah. It's another supervisor 7 MR. • As that Supervisory 7 there, also 8 Correctional Services -- 8 MR. Oh, there's two of you? 9 MS. : Uh-huh. 9 MS. Yeah, it's two of us. 10 MR. : -- Specialist, what does 10 MR. • And who is the other one? 11 that job duty and responsibilities, what does 11 MS. : Her name is 12 that all entail? 12 13 MS. : I'm the supervisor of intake, 13 MR. Do you happen to know how 14 intake and receiving, receiving and discharge 14 to spell that last name? 15 of inmates, when they come in and when they 15 MS. . But she goes 16 leave. 16 by 17 MR. Okay. 17 MR. Oh, okay. 18 MS. We supervise the staff. 18 MS. Yeah. 19 MR. And you, so, basically, 19 MR. • So, is a second 20 is that considered R&D? 20 last name? 21 MS. : R&D, yes. 21 MS. : Yeah. Uh-huh. 22 MR. : So, receiving and 22 Uh-huh. 23 dischargifillt 23 MR. Okay. Okay. And do you, 24 MS. IIIII: Yes. Receiving and 24 like, differentiate between your duties, the 25 discharging. Yes. 25 two of you? EFTA00114725  13 14 1 MS. ■: No, not really. We all do the 1 position at that time, correct? 2 same thin cause we're on different shifts. 2 MS. : Yes. 3 MR. : Okay. 3 MR. : And you have already 4 MS. : So, we do the same thing on 4 described your duties and responsibilities. 5 each shift. 5 Did you have any interaction or involvement 6 MR. Okay. So you both are 6 with Epstein during his stay at the MCC? 7 responsible for the same thing? 7 MS. : No. 8 MS. Yes. Uh-huh. 8 MR. What about when he came 9 MR. Just different times of 9 in or when he -- 10 day? 10 MS. : No. I don't recall. No. I 11 MS. Just the times of day, yes. 11 don't think I ever seen him. 12 MR. How long have you been in 12 MR. No? 13 that position? 13 MS. Huh-uh. No. 14 MS. ■: I've been in the position, it 14 MR. Okay. 15 will be three ears in April. 15 MS. Huh-uh. 16 MR. : And do you remember when 16 MR. Not on suicide watch or 17 you started? 17 anything like that? 18 MS. I started in April 2019. 18 MS. : No. Huh-uh. 19 MR. Okay. Great. All right. 19 MR. Or in SHU? 20 Now, are familiar with Jeffrey Epstein? 20 MS. 21 MS. Yes. 21 MR. Okay. 22 MR. Okay. And was he housed 22 MS. Huh-uh. 23 within the MCC in July and August of 2019? 23 MR. Do you recall if you 24 MS. : Yes. I think so. Yes. 24 actually worked at the MCC on August 9th and 25 MR. And you had the same 25 10th, 2019? 16 1 MS. : I don't recall, but I probably 1 years ago. 2 did day watch, 6 to 2. I probably was here 2 MR. : Sure. 3 during the day. 3 MS. : So I don't remember who was 4 MR. : Okay. So, 6 a.m. to 2 4 on. 5 p.m.? 5 MR. : Do you all, like, so, R&D 6 MS. : Yes. 6 is a different piece with us. We have, like, 7 MR. : On August 9th? 7 all, like, the, oh, what is it called, the 8 MS. : Uh-huh. I probably was. I 8 daily, like, schedule and logs of everybody who 9 got to look at m 9 worked -- 10 MR. • That would be a Friday. 10 MS. : All the lieutenants, yeah, 11 MS. . Yeah. I have to look at it, 11 that's the lieutenant log. 12 and see if I was here. 12 MR. : Yeah. Do you guys, well, 13 MR. : Okay. And would they 13 this is different. I'm talking about, like, 14 have been the same duties and responsibilities 14 the, like, who was working in the custody side 15 that you have described? 15 of the house. Do you guys have, like, anything 16 MS. : Yes. Yes. 16 like that, like, for instance, here would be 17 MR. Okay. 17 the August 10, 2019 daily assignment roster. 18 MS. Uh-huh. 18 MS. : Yeah. We have a daily 19 MR. And who would you 19 assignment but not a roster. 20 primarily work with during that time? 20 MR. : Okay. 21 MS. : I work with all the CSOs, 21 MS. : It's a daily assignment. It 22 Correctional Systems Officers. I don't know 22 will have, like, everybody's name that's on it, 23 who was on that da -- 23 and we just check off who is here. 24 MR. : Okay. 24 MR. Okay. 25 MS. : -- cause that was, like, two 25 MS. : And then we'll put who is not EFTA00114726  17 18 1 here, like, AL for Annual Leave, SL for Sick 1 MS. : He's over in Brooklyn now. 2 Leave. But we do have that, but it doesn't 2 MR. Okay. 3 look like that. 3 MS. : Over there. 4 MR. Okay. So, would we be 4 MR. And what was his position 5 able to go back and see who actually worked on 5 then? 6 August 9, 2019? 6 MS. a CMC. 7 MS. : Ninth, yes, we should have it. 7 MR. : What does a CMC stand 8 Yes. 8 for? 9 MR. Can I ask you terribly to 9 MS. : Case Manager Coordinator. 10 do me some favors and start, can you, can we 10 MR. Okay. 11 start a list and ask you to, like, provide some 11 MS. : Yeah. CMC, Case Manager 12 of this stuff for us? 12 Coordinator. Uh-huh. 13 MS. : Yeah. You can write it down. 13 MR. : And who would be the Case 14 Uh-huh. 14 Manager Coordinator now? 15 MR. Awesome. So, if you want 15 MS. 16 to start, , just, the first one would be 16 MR. Oh, he's still the same 17 who was assigned on August 9th, August 8th and 17 one? 18 9th, 2019. And did you report to anyone? Who 18 MS. : But he's still the same 19 did you rIpITI to back then? 19 person, but he's over in Brooklyn. 20 MS. IIIII: My supervisor was 20 MR. : When you say Brooklyn, at 21 (Phonetic Sp. *00:10:12) We call him 21 the MDC? 22 can't even pronounce, we call, his last name, I 22 MS. : MDC Brooklyn. Yes. 23 can't even pronounce his last name, but we call 23 MR. Okay. 24 him 24 MS. Yes. 25 Okay. 25 MR. And did all those people 19 20 1 that you mentioned that work in R&D, did they 1 any information with regard to any suspicious 2 report to ou? 2 activity that occurred on August 9th or 10th, 3 MS. Yes. 3 2019 -- 4 MR. Okay. 4 MS. : No. 5 MS. Uh-huh. Me and Ms. 5 MR. -- leading up to the 6 MR. Okay. And were you 6 discovery of Epstein in his cell? 7 previously interviewed under this 7 MS. : No. 8 investigation? 8 MR. : No? Okay. So, these 9 MS. : No. 9 are, now, we'll get into kind of the reason why 10 MR. No? 10 we're here, is to get into this documentation. 11 MS. : Huh-uh. 11 So, we have, there's an inmate, it's, Epstein 12 MR. Do you have any, what is 12 was housed with a cellmate named Efrain Reyes. 13 your understanding of what happened to Epstein 13 MS. : Uh-huh. 14 on August 9th and 10th of 2019? 14 MR. And we have a couple of 15 MS. : That he just committed 15 things comin from the U.S. Marshalls Service. 16 suicide. That's it. 16 MS. : Okay. 17 MR. : Okay. So, do you know 17 MR. Saying what was going on 18 how he died? 18 with Efrain Re So here is one. It says 19 MS. No. Huh-uh. 19 it's from a 20 MR. No? Do you know if he, 20 MS. Uh-huh. 21 like, died of hanging or anything like that? 21 MR. It was sent on 22 MS. : I guess it was hanging. I 22 Thursday, ust 8, 2019, at 10:34 a.m. 23 heard it was hanging, but I don't, I didn't 23 MS. : Uh-huh. 24 really, like, ask, cause -- 24 MR. And it's, you're one of 25 MR. Okay. And do you have 25 the, it looks like it says R & - EFTA00114727  21 22 1 MS..Yeah, that's all R&D. Yeah. 1 MR. Elzahr, E-L-Z-A-H-R. 2 MR. : Okay. So, it was sent to 2 MS. : Uh-huh. 3 all R&D. 3 MR. : Again, this is all, like, 4 MS. IIIIIii i-huh. Yeah. 4 R&D. MR. : And yourself, and it 5 MS. R&D and other staff, yes. 6 says, "Transfer of Prisoners from NYM to GEO." 6 MR. : As well as the 7 MS. .ro CEO, yes. 7 lieutenants and, okay. 8 MR. : So, is that from the MCC 8 MS. • Yes. Uh-huh. 9 to the contract facility? 9 MR. There's you, and it says, 10 MS. : Yeah, from MCC, and he's 10 "Prisoner p roduction, 8/9/2019." Thursday, 11 CEO, yes. 11 August 8, 2019. 12 MR. IIIIIIIIII: Okay. Great. And then, 12 MS. • Was sent out -- 13 in the body, it says, "The following prisoners 13 MR. That was sent at 3:36 14 are to be transferred." 14 p.m. 15 MS. • Yes. 15 MS. Uh-huh. 16 MR. It says Javon Bussey and 16 MR. And then within it, it 17 then Efrain Reyes. 17 has the prisoner's schedule report, and the 18 MS. • Yes. 18 second person, there are the two people that I 19 MR. • "Please schedule transfer 19 just listed -- 20 for Frida 8/9/19." 20 MS. : Yes. 21 MS. • Uh-huh. 21 MR. . -- and the second person 22 MR. And we have another one, 22 being Efrain Reyes. 23 the same date, it says it's from a different 23 MS. : Yes. 24 person with the Marshals Service, saying - 24 MR. And it says, "Transfer 25 MS. : Elzahr. 25 within." 23 24 1 MS. : Yes. 1 this, does this, cause this person also is 2 MR. : Does this tell you what 2 listed as transfer within, court. 3 happened with Efrain Reyes? 3 MS. : Yeah, and court. Yes. 4 MS. : This just says that he 4 MR. . And everybody else -- 5 transferred to GEO. That's it. That's what 5 MS. Uh-huh. 6 this says. He's transferring. 6 MR. -- no one else has that 7 MR. : Okay. 7 next to their name. They all have, like, 8 MS. : That's all it says. But right 8 sentencing_ligging, sentencing, status hearing. 9 here, when they do a transfer, I don't know, 9 MS. IIIII: Yeah, but that still, the type 10 like, right here, this says court. So, I don't 10 is court. That's just what they're going to 11 know if he went out to court and then they 11 court for. 12 transferred him ou see what I'm saying? 12 MR. : Right. So, this one, 13 MR. : Uh-huh. 13 though, being that says transfer within, court 14 MS. : Cause this says court. And 14 15 plus, as me being a supervisor, I don't do the 15 MS. : Transfer, he's transferring, 16 movement. 16 and he (Indiscernible *00:14:16). 17 MR. Okay. So who, who -- 17 MR. : Does that mean he was 18 MS. I'm not the movement officer. 18 going to court, or that's just an automatic 19 MR. : So who would do that? 19 field? 20 MS. 20 MS. : I guess that's automatically, 21 MR. would be the one? 21 they put that there, cause this is the U.S. 22 MS. Yes. Yeah she does the 22 Marshals form. So, I think they automatically 23 movement. Me and Ms. , we don't do the 23 just put that there. I think what it is, is 24 movement. 24 that when they come and pick up the inmates, 25 MR. Okay. So, based upon 25 cause the U.S. Marshals will pick up the EFTA00114728  25 26 1 inmates. 1 on Sentry and do a PP 64 and put the reg 2 MR. . Uh-huh. 2 number, and we put T for transfer, and down at 3 MS. : And they will transfer them. 3 the bottom, we could put as many reg, I think 4 So, I guess they go sit over there, like 4 it's like 20 reg numbers down there, of whoever 5 they're going to court, and then GEO comes over 5 inmates are leaving, and then a 64 will be 6 there and they pick them up from the U.S. 6 printed out. 7 Marshals. 7 MR. Okay. 8 MR. . Okay. 8 MS. And it's just a transit form. 9 MS. That's how it works. 9 MR. Now is there something 10 MR. • So, when someone is 10 that's like, would these people be placed on 11 transferred, so, when these people are 11 the court list, though? 12 transferred from here to GEO -- 12 MS. : Yes. Yes. 13 MS. : Uh-huh. 13 MR. : Okay, so they would be 14 MR. : -- what document is 14 put on the court -- 15 created by, I guess it sounds like , but 15 MS. : They would be placed on the 16 by the BOP (Indiscernible *00:14:53)? 16 court list es. Yes. 17 MS. : We only do like a, we need, 17 MR. : And what would it say 18 like a transfer receipt from the Marshals, 18 next to their name? 19 saying that they're going to transfer and we 19 MS. : WAG. 20 usually just need a 64. 20 MR. . And that's it? 21 MR. IIIIIIIIII: Uh-huh. 21 MS. : Yes. That's it. 22 MS. IIIII: And a medical summary. A 64 22 MR. : Okay. 23 is a transit form. 23 MS. Uh-huh. That's what she 24 MR. Okay. 24 usually puts, AB, on there. 25 MS. : That the BOP, that we just go 25 MR. Now, if that court list 27 28 1 is provided to us, so if Epstein was housed in 1 transferred? 2 the SHU, the SHU would be provided that court 2 MS. : They wouldn't know that. 3 list, correct? 3 MR. : They wouldn't know that? 4 MS. : Yes. 4 They woulLji t know it was WAB? 5 MR. • It would say -- 5 MS. IIIII: Cause it's really, like, it's 6 MS. It would be like a, it's like 6 really none of their business. 7 a roster. not -- 7 MR. : Right. Okay. 8 MR. I said Epstein, I'm 8 MS. : Yeah. They would just know 9 sorry, I mean, Efrain Reyes. 9 that he's one. know what I mean? 10 MS. • Yeah, it's like -- 10 MR. : Well, because, like, kind 11 MR. If Reyes was housed in 11 of like when you said, when I said, you knew 12 the SHU -- 12 who Efrain, or, you know, Epstein was or is, 13 MS. : It's like a roster. They 13 you said, yeah, he went to court. 14 wouldn't get this or anything like that. It's 14 MS. : Yeah. Uh-huh. 15 just like you go on Sentry and you print out a 15 MR. : Cause, is that -- 16 roster and it will have his name on there, and 16 MS. : Yeah, cause, I'm - 17 then we'll write down what unit he's on, and 17 MR. • -- so, like, that's 18 then internal will come and pick it up, or they 18 actually the rumor? 19 will hand it out, whatever, whoever is going 19 MS. : That's what, that's what it 20 out to court, that's the unit that they give 20 would be, or we'll call up there, like, are you 21 the court list to. 21 going to send Efrain Reyes down, and they will 22 MR. . Okay. 22 say, yeah, he's going to court, and then if he 23 MS. That's how it works. 23 doesn't come back, we might call up there, or 24 MR. So, would those people 24 they will know that he's not, cause he's not, 25 know if he was going to court or being 25 or they'll call us and ask us. EFTA00114729  29 30 1 MR. : Okay. 1 any way for the SHU staff to know, he's leaving 2 MS. : You know? Or something like 2 and not cAcEuIg back, rather than -- 3 that. So, they should have, I'm thinking they 3 MS. IIIII: See, we don't, like, it 4 should have known we would have probably, 4 depends. Cause we really don't, we really 5 somebody probably would have told them that he 5 don't tell them, like, if I talk to them, I 6 wasn't comin back he was getting transferred. 6 might say like he's not coming back. 7 MR. : Okay. So, as far as 7 MR. : Okay. 8 this, there's the daily log, 8/9/2019, and on 8 MS. : Or so, I might tell them, so I 9 the third page of this shows Reyes, pre- 9 don't know, on that day, who called up there 10 removed. 10 and told them to have him ready, you know what 11 MS. : Yes. 11 I mean? And have him ready, and he's not 12 MR. Now, if he was just going 12 coming back. 13 to court -- 13 MR. : Now, who would normally 14 MS. It would say court. 14 call and tell them that? 15 MR. Yeah. It wouldn't say 15 MS. : It would be the person that's 16 pre-removed? 16 working in R&D. 17 MS. : It wouldn't say pre-removed. 17 MR. Okay. So would it be 18 Yes. 18 probably for this, as well? 19 MR. So, this is, by looking 19 MS. : It wouldn't be . Yeah, 20 at all of this, I'm assuming you can tell, 20 she just does the movement. 21 yeah, he was never going to court. He was 21 MR. Okay. 22 always goin to be transferred? 22 MS. That's it. 23 MS. He was going, yes. Yes. Yes. 23 MR. It wouldn't have been 24 MR. Okay. And I think this 24 her? 25 may have been what you were saying. Is there 25 MS. : No, it wouldn't have been her. 31 32 1 MR. : All right. 1 true. 2 MS. : She just does the movement. 2 MR. So, a person who would 3 So, it would be the person that's on the front 3 say, yeah, I know it's with all belongings, 4 desk. 4 and, you know, we know it's very likely, there, 5 MR. So, if the people that 5 he's not going to come back, but we don't know 6 escorted Re es down -- 6 for sure. Does that sound at all reasonable? 7 MS. Uh-huh. 7 MS. : They probably would have 8 MR. -- to R&D and they knew 8 asked, like, called to see if he was coming 9 that WAB was actually, in fact, listed next to 9 back. Like, it was after, maybe 4:00 or 10 his name -- 10 something like that -- 11 MS. : Uh-huh. 11 MR. Then they usually would - 12 MR. -- should have they known 12 13 that he is not coming back, if it says WAB? 13 MS. : -- they probably would have 14 MS. : Not really. 14 asked if he was coming back, cause, like, when 15 MR. : No? 15 I first transferred here, I worked in Brooklyn 16 MS. : Because they don't work R&D. 16 and then I transferred to Butner. I didn't 17 You see what I mean? They work custody. 17 know what WAB meant -- 18 MR. : Okay. 18 MR. : Right. 19 MS. : So, it depends who was up 19 MS. : -- until I got here, cause we 20 there. It could have been new staff, who 20 don't use WAB what I mean? 21 knows. Cause a lot of people don't know what 21 MR. : Yeah, but if these 22 WAB does. 22 people, if these people absolutely said no, we 23 MR. : Well, they know it means 23 know what WAB is -- 24 "with all belongings." 24 MS. : WAR, yes. 25 MS. : Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's 25 MR. -- but they thought, you EFTA00114730  33 34 1 know, if they're claiming, well, we thought he 1 could, he could have returned. Is that a legit 2 was going to court, and there's always a chance 2 3 he could come back from court? So, see what 3 MS. : No. Not a WAB. 4 I'm sayin ? So, with this guy -- 4 MR. No? So, a WAB, they 5 MS. : Yeah. 5 should have known he ain't coming back? 6 MR. : -- so this goes, so where 6 MS. : Huh-uh. He's not coming back • 7 this fits in is, Epstein, did you know that 7 Yeah. 8 Epstein was required to have a cellmate? 8 MR. Okay. 9 MS. ..didn't know that, no. 9 MS. WAR. 10 MR. : Okay. So, he was 10 MR. Okay. 11 required to have a cellmate, and Reyes was his 11 MS. : Unless we tell you something 12 cellmate. 12 different. But a WAB, he's not coming back. 13 MS. : Okay. 13 MR. Okay. So, it's the 14 MR. : So, part of the reason 14 primary uestion then. 15 why they're saying that Epstein died is because 15 MS. • Yes. 16 his cellmate was removed and never replaced. 16 MR. Great. So, again, to 17 So, you know, some people say it's because of 17 you, so, (Indiscernible *00:20:19), he was 18 the 30 minute rounds, or a lot of it is the 18 being transferred, not going to court. 19 combination, some people are saying, well, 19 MS. : Not going to court. But I 20 there was no one in his cell, so he took 20 guess the Marshal just put court, because when 21 advantage of not having anybody in there. 21 they come, if a WAB is leaving with the 22 MS. : Okay. 22 Marshals, they usually just put court, because 23 MR. : So, in this case, the SHU 23 they pick the inmates up -- 24 staff, some people are saying, yep, I knew he 24 MR. All the same -- 25 was WAB, but there's always a chance that he 25 MS. -- everybody at the same time, 35 36 1 and take them over there, so that's why they 1 the Marshals. And then this one is the list 2 have court. 2 that the Marshals put out, also, so they kind 3 MR. • Okay. 3 of go hand-in-hand. 4 MS. On their form. 4 MR. : How the pick-up itself is 5 MR. • So, this is, anytime we 5 (Indiscernible *00:21:30). 6 present someone with documents, you just ask 6 MS. : Yes, how the pick-up, yes. 7 them to initial and date it. 7 But everything is going to say court on the 8 MS. : Okay. 8 side, because the Marshals are going to pick 9 MR. : It's not to vouch for 9 up, when they pick up the court, they're 10 the, not certifying it's accurate, just so you 10 picking uiliii,WABs also. 11 can say, this is what we discussed. 11 MR. : And on that court document, 12 MS. • What I saw. Okay. 12 you might have answered this already, the court 13 MR. So, just anywhere. And 13 document that's created internally, it would 14 it is the 4th. 14 have said WAB? 15 MR. : So, the two emails, 15 MS. : Yeah. Like, it's like almost, 16 technically, what you're saying, this goes 16 a receipt, a transfer receipt that we do. 17 18 19 hand-in-hand, one says he's being transferred, 17 the other one states that he is being picked up 18 by the Marshals (Indiscernible *00:21:09). MR. MS. • Okay. : And it will say WAB. It will 19 say, like, it will say his reg number, his 20 MS. : Yeah. Yeah. They both go 20 name, and it will say his unit and it will say 21 hand-in-hand, because this one is the Marshals, 21 pre-removed, so pre-removed, that means he's 22 that they're telling us, but they're telling us 22 not coming_kEE. You know what I mean? 23 WAR, he's going to GEO. So, we'll know he's 23 MR. 'I'll': And that's (Indiscernible 24 transferring to another state. That's another 24 *00:22:04). 25 state facility that houses federal inmates for 25 MS. : Pre-removed. Yeah. He's not EFTA00114731  37 38 1 coming back. So that's what would it be. It 1 MR. : If you can provide us -- 2 would sayiiiiemoved. 2 MS. Okay. 3 MR. : Do you have a copy of an 3 MR. : I'll put that on here. 4 example of what that court document looks like? 4 MS. : I'll put that, write that 5 No, right? Is it ossible that we -- 5 down. Write down Marshals, like a Marshals 6 MR. : The court list? 6 receipt. And I can give you a copy of it. 7 MR. : The court list. Do we, if 7 I'll black, can I blacken out the inmate's 8 you can provide us with one? 8 photos on there? 9 MS. : We don't have, huh-uh. 9 MR. : That's fine. 10 MR. : No, not that one, but any 10 MR. • Photos and the name, if 11 type of -- 11 you want. 12 MS. : Which one? 12 MS. Okay. 13 MR. -- what it looks like? 13 MR. • We just need to see -- 14 MS. : Any samples? 14 MS. You just want to see -- 15 MR. : Yeah. 15 MR. -- what it says next to 16 MS. I could -- 16 their names. 17 MR. : Has it changed since that 17 MS. Yeah, their new one. 18 time, that document? 18 MR. To tell the difference, 19 MS. : Cause we do a, but, yeah, the 19 differentiate if 20 Marshals, now they got a picture on theirs, the 20 MS. : The ones that the Marshals -- 21 picture of the inmate and stuff like that. And 21 MR. . -- somebody is going to 22 now we sign for it. I don't know if that's 22 court or someone is being transferred, you 23 because of E stein. I don't know. 23 know. 24 MR. : But we just want an example. 24 MS. : Okay. 25 MS. : Now we have to sign. 25 MR. : With that, just so we can e 39 40I 1 say, like, cause, like you said, you don't have 1 would email to the unit team and to medical, 2 that court list anymore? 2 stating that she needs a medical summary form. 3 MS. : No. Huh-uh. No. Huh-uh. 3 MR. : Okay. So, and she would 4 MR. : And are they maintained 4 have sent the court list? 5 for any amount of period of them? 5 MS. : Yeah, she would have sent the, 6 MS. : We, no. Huh-uh. 6 like, not, see, he would, since he is WAB, it 7 MR. : So that day, you get rid 7 would be a receipt that she would send out, 8 of them? 8 saying that she needed a medical summary and a 9 MS. : Uh-huh. Yeah. 9 64 for him. 10 MR. : And there are never 10 MR. : Okay. Make sure you're 11 emails orinything? 11 documenting_Illose, too. 12 MS. IIIII: I don't know how far my emails 12 MS. IIIII: Yeah, they wouldn't get the, 13 are going to go back. You see what I'm saying? 13 they wouldn't get the court list, like the unit 14 I don't tihiiiiiiiiails go all the way back. 14 team that, his unit team and the medical 15 MR. : Well, we have access to 15 department wouldn't get the court list. She 16 be able to et everybody's emails. 16 would do her own one and send it, saying that 17 MS. : Okay. 17 they're leaving, those two are leaving and can 18 MR. : Cause we actually got 18 you please send me a medical summary and a 64? 19 those, some of these from -- 19 MR. : But the actual court list 20 MS. : So, you could probably look 20 wouldn't be emailed to anybody? 21 and see. 21 MS. : Yeah. It probably would. I 22 MR. But are they ever 22 don't know how the Marshal was doing it at that 23 emailed? 23 time. I think they were doing it just like 24 MS. : Because that would be 24 that. But we don't email the Marshals court 25 would, yeah, she would have did it, because she 25 list to anybody like that. EFTA00114732  41 42 1 MR. No, no, no. I mean, 1 MS. o. Huh-uh. 2 like, don't you create what you give to the 2 MR. Printed out, given out -- 3 SHU, saying 3 MS. : Given out. Yeah. Uh-huh. 4 MS. IIIII: It's a roster. It's on a, 4 MR. -- then basically 5 when we go on Sentry, that's how it's created. 5 shredded? 6 MR. But is it still on 6 MS. Yeah. 7 Sentry, that -- 7 MR. Trashed? 8 MS. o. It gets deleted. 8 MS. Uh-huh. 9 MR. Okay. 9 MR. All right. So there's no 10 MS. : Yeah. And we get a new, we do 10 way for us, whatever was created, saying what 11 a new one. 11 it said next to Efrain Reyes's name, whether it 12 MR. : Every day? 12 said WAB or not, there's no wa to tell -- 13 MS. rah. And that's what 13 MS. : I can ask to see -- 14 does. 14 MR. Yeah, yeah. We're going 15 MR. So, it's only kept for 15 to talk to her. 16 that one da 16 MS. : Yeah. Talk to, and see if she 17 MS. : Yes. Yes. Uh-huh. 17 has it. 18 MR. . And there's no way to -- 18 MR. : When she came in, just so 19 MS. And it's not really even kept. 19 you know, she was great. She was very 20 MR. . Right. 20 cooperative. 21 MS. : We just print it out. That's 21 MS. : Yeah. To see if -- 22 it. Like, we got, when we go in to do another 22 MR. : But we didn't have these 23 one, we got to delete the old one. 23 documents when we talked with her. 24 MR. : Okay. So, it's never 24 MS. : Yeah, to see if she has it. 25 kept for any period of time, really? 25 If ya'll could go back in her email, I don't 43 44